========================================================================= Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 10:43:22 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Ann Partridge Subject: Re: Willa and the lost souls MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-05-31 03:12:31 EDT, you write: << I can't remember if we were told at what age Willa was "released" into "civilation".>> I would guess that happened within a year of her establishing and that is part of the reason why she was so adaptable and learned so quickly. << In keeping gens in captivity, the need to drug them to keep them well behaved and quiet might battle with the fact that a less drugged gen can do more towards looking after themselves. >> Yes, and it would probably be cheaper and more conducive to the overall health of the Gens to keep them less drugged as well. I would think that the Sime who ran pens would be able to zlin how much to drug a particular Gen and give each Gen the mimimum amount of drugging needed to keep them under control. There are probably even different types of drugs with differing effects available. I recall that Henry Steers was given something particularly nasty, not something that was routinely used on every Gen. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 12:49:05 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Karen Litman Subject: Retardation and Developmental Disabilities MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit << Retarded means exactly that - that in some way the development has been retarded or slowed down. This is why it's specified that if the "damage" happens before the age of 18 it's retardation, afterwards it's brain damage. >> I'd argue this statement. There are many types of retarded development, though I know we are currently using the information as "mental" development. I suffer from brain damage which I received at birth or prior to birth, but I was fortunate that it didn't effect my mental development, only my physical development (Cerebral Palsy). In New Jersey there is a group called the Division of Developmental Disabilities in which Mental Retardation, Epilepsy, Cerebral Palsy and Autism classifications of people can find assistance. Brain Damage can also cause physical and mental injuries later in life. Drug abuse, and battle injuries can also cause mental retardation, speech problems and other physical difficulties. These are a few of many possible causes. There are others. Working with the disabled all my life, I've done a lot of research on the topic. I am by no means an expert. --- Karen Litman ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 13:09:29 -0400 Reply-To: Jacqueline Lichtenberg Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jacqueline Lichtenberg Subject: Fw: Re: "The Only Good Sime"-- New fan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Folks: The following is from Kerry Lindeman-Schaefer -- author of THE ONLY GOOD SIME who is not on this List. > Anybody interested in Frevven is perfectly welcome to email me, if > they wish. I'd be happy to answer any questions or discuss the stories > with them. > Kerry > kerry@cconnect.net > JL ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 19:01:44 +1700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Tony Zbaraschuk Subject: Re: Willa and the lost souls In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19990531170427.00927860@mail.xenon.net> from "Eliza and Zoe" at May 31, 99 05:04:29 pm Content-Type: text Eliza wrote: > I can't remember if we were told at what age Willa was "released" into > "civilation". I suspect that the normal Pen Gen was delivered over to be killed shortly after they begun producing selyn (_unless_ they were needed as a breeder or farm worker -- the Pen Gens need to feed themselves since I don't think there are enough working Simes to take up the load), so Willa was probably around the age of puberty, likely 14-15 or a bit younger. (Sexually mature enough to get pregnant not long after her first transfer and subsequent interlude post with Jordi, too -- though that was a few months after Rimon and Kadi picked her up.) So her rapid learning is probably a product of Gen First Year development. > I would imagin that much would depend on the age of the > person being rehabilitated, the length of time that person was on the drugs > (were they born in a pen, or captured at a later age?) and the amount of > drug administered, as well as the type (different gen pens might have > different attitudes towards the use of drugs, as well as using different > types) None of which we have anywhere near enough data to figure out... > In keeping gens in captivity, the need to drug them to keep them well > behaved and quiet might battle with the fact that a less drugged gen can do > more towards looking after themselves. Yup. The Gens _have_ to look after themselves, sort of, or the system falls apart due to lack of supervision. There's probably _some_ drugging, but the heavy stuff is likely just something administered to them shortly before they're delivered, to keep them quiet during that stage. And Rimon, early in FC, thinks of Gens being "trained" to obey Simes, not drugged into it. Probably one could pull a fair number of possible methods of Pen operation from the history of slaveholding. (This also explains Willa's relatively normal language development: she picked it up during childhood like everything else. See also Trini's case in _Ambrov Keon_.) Tony Z ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 13:47:49 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Dancer Subject: Re: SIMEGEN-L Digest - 26 May 1999 to 27 May 1999 (#1999-146) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jaye wrote: > > Hmmm.... does anyone have any idea how many cows, chickens, pigs, etc, go into maintaining 1 person for a year in the US? And we have to remember that not all people in the US are omnivores and even eat meat. We eat more frequently than Simes kill/take transfer, but we don't consume an entire animal on our own at once. I can't swear to the figure for dense techniques, but I recall reading a report on sustainable systems, and it put forward that to support one adult human indefinitely AND sustainably (assuming no input of fertilizers, or any other soil-replenisher, and indefinitely defined as 'until the sun goes cold') requires a minimum of 8 acres of bushland/woods/forest in a temperate or subtropical climate. (Or was it sixteen? Certainly not less than eight) D ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 19:53:04 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jaye Subject: Re: SIMEGEN-L Digest - 30 May 1999 to 31 May 1999 (#1999-150) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Eliza and Zoe I'm guessing Willa was released to Rimon shortly after establishment. We know that the new Gen's field rises very quickly and then levels off if transfer is not taken. It seems that there was a comment between Rimon and Kadi to the effect that she needs to not get pregnant before her "courses" (periods) have been regular for 6 months. Kadi established about age 16, if I'm not mistaken and there were those who wondered if she ever would. Which if Willa was on a more average maturation schedule would put her anywhere from 10-13 when she established. >In keeping gens in captivity, the need to drug them to keep them well >behaved and quiet might battle with the fact that a less drugged gen can do >more towards looking after themselves. I see some inconsistencies in Jean's storys... on the Farris Genfarm, the gens were mostly self-aware, had language however rudimentary. In AK, the pregens (Triffin's crew) were bought as workers... I'd think that even for pen gens, there would be a push to get all possible work from the pre-gens, and if they were so drugged they didn't even learn language, that wouldn't have worked. It could be argued that drugs had changed between FC and AK... but a drugged-senseless pre-gen is still a drugged-senseless pre-gen. "Watch for falling assumptions!" _All_ unsolicited .exe files will be summarily deleted without opening. Jaye orchestra@wingedharper.com www.wingedharper.com ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 07:35:31 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Larry P Ulrey Subject: Update on my mom. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My mom had a couple of tests. They've now ruled out colon cancer and they put a tube down into her stomach to look at it and they say she doesn't have an ulcer. However, she still complains of her stomach hurting. They're going to do some more tests today. Otherwise, she seems to be getting better. Larry Ulrey ulrey@juno.com ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 07:35:46 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Larry P Ulrey Subject: Fw: OT:Jokes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --------- Forwarded message ---------- SIGNS OF THE TIMES Spotted on the back of a T-shirt worn by LAPD Bomb Squad: "If you see me running, try to keep up." Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak. You have the right to remain silent anything you say will be misquoted, then used against you. Should you trust a stockbroker who's married to a travel agent? A closed mouth gathers no feet. Don't you think it's unnerving that doctors call what they do "Practice"? Did you ever notice that Evian bottled water is Naive spelled backwards? Think about it..... Seduce my mind & you can have my body, find my soul & I'm yours forever. The grass may actually be greener on the other side of the fence, but it still has to be mowed. ........................................................... HOW MANY DOGS DOES IT TAKE TO CHANGE A LIGHT BULB? Afghan: Light bulb? What light bulb? Golden Retriever: The sun is shining, the day is young, we've got our whole lives ahead of us, and you're worrying about a burned-out light bulb? Border Collie: Just one. And I'll replace any wiring that's not up to date. Dachshund: I can't reach the stupid lamp! Toy Poodle: I'll just blow in the border collie's ear and he'll do it. Rottweiler: Make me! Shi-tzu: Puh-leeez, dahling. I have servants for that kind of thing. Labrador: Oh, me, me!!!! Pleeeeeeaze let me change the light bulb!!! Can I? Can I? Huh? Huh? Can I? Malamute: Let the border collie do it. You can feed me while he's busy. Cocker Spaniel: Why change it? I can still pee on the carpet in the dark. Doberman Pinscher: While it's dark, I'm going to sleep on the couch. Mastiff: Mastiffs are not afraid of the dark. Beagle: Light bulb? Light bulb? That thing I ate was a light bulb? Cat: You mean you need light to see? ........................................................... ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 09:11:05 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Eliza and Zoe Subject: Confusing Ancient neighbours Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Last Friday I hurt my back lifting things that gens should probibly let simes lift (or at least big strong male gens, neither of which I had handy at the time). Anyway, it was bad enough to mean very little movement for this gen for a few days. I spent Saturday and Sunday laying on my back very still. Sunday night I was playing "Homer" (as in Simpson, not as in the Greek). "Zoe, can I have a cup of tea? Zoe, can you change the TV channel? Zoe, can you rub my head? Zoe, can I have a piece of toast? Zoe, come talk to me, Zoe ....." (Answer from the kitchen) "Hold on hold on, I only have 8 tentacles!" (Rather shocked voice from flat next door - her back door overlooks our kitchen window) "Only EIGHT TENTACLES?????!!!!!!" (Zoe's reply) "Well, yes, the other four are for more important things!" Zoe then left the kitchen, laughing, to tell me what the neighbour said. The neighbour has been seen giving us rather odd looks since then..... :) Eliza ambrov Halwyn Companion to Zoe Farris ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 20:35:02 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Ann Partridge Subject: Re: Confusing Ancient neighbours MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-06-01 19:17:27 EDT, you write: << Zoe then left the kitchen, laughing, to tell me what the neighbour said. The neighbour has been seen giving us rather odd looks since then..... >> "Abneeeeeerrrrrrrrrr! ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 21:39:50 -0400 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Lisa W Subject: Re: Update on my mom. In-Reply-To: <19990601.073549.-199689.6.ulrey@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Oh I hope and pray that your mom can be healthy again and that they find out what's wrong. i know how awful being sick is unfortunately and I am sending your mom a hug! Hugs all around! Lisa ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 02:28:16 -0400 Reply-To: Amy Harlib Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Amy Harlib Subject: Re: Confusing Ancient neighbours MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LOL!!!!! Made my day! Thank you for that. ----- Original Message ----- From: Eliza and Zoe To: Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 1999 7:11 PM Subject: Confusing Ancient neighbours > Last Friday I hurt my back lifting things that gens should probibly let > simes lift (or at least big strong male gens, neither of which I had handy > at the time). Anyway, it was bad enough to mean very little movement for > this gen for a few days. I spent Saturday and Sunday laying on my back > very still. Sunday night I was playing "Homer" (as in Simpson, not as in > the Greek). > > "Zoe, can I have a cup of tea? Zoe, can you change the TV channel? Zoe, > can you rub my head? Zoe, can I have a piece of toast? Zoe, come talk to > me, Zoe ....." > > (Answer from the kitchen) > > "Hold on hold on, I only have 8 tentacles!" > > (Rather shocked voice from flat next door - her back door overlooks our > kitchen window) > > "Only EIGHT TENTACLES?????!!!!!!" > > (Zoe's reply) > > "Well, yes, the other four are for more important things!" > > Zoe then left the kitchen, laughing, to tell me what the neighbour said. > The neighbour has been seen giving us rather odd looks since then..... > > :) > > Eliza ambrov Halwyn > Companion to Zoe Farris > > ---------- > You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. > To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to > LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text > "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". > ---------- ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 16:30:54 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Cheryl Wolverton Subject: Chat Friday Night Comments: To: "Tweetybd@Fortwayne. Infi. Net" , "Tracy J. Jones" , Terry Fowler , Terri Writes , Suzi Whidbey , "skvink@MIDUSA. NET" , "SKrinard@aol. com" , Skip Caraway , Silke Juppenlatz , Sherrilyn Kenyon , Sherrilyn Kenyon , Sherri Cobb-South , "Raytina@Netnitco. Net" , "Qtpie@Jps. Net" , Nat Bayles , Mary Lou Mendum , Mary Froemke , "MartinGA@AOL. COM" , Martha Johnson , Mark Porulx , Lynn Emery , Lyn Cote , "Lslawik@T-THREE. COM" , Karen Litman , Kaas Baichtal , Joyce Livingston , Jon Drake , Johnna Goss , "John A. Carey" , Jane Toombs , Jackie A Bielowicz , J ean Gordon , ibrand@zoomnet.net, "Henderso@Wwa. Com" , Heather Lee Lewis , Heather , "Hawkins@Iniaccess. Net. Au" , "Ham@Psnw. Com" , Hafsteinn Elvar Jakobsson , greene@VISI.NET, Glenn Hauman , "Gina R. Hutcherson" , "Gillenberg@AOL. COM" , George Szaszvari , George , Debbie Prescott , Debbie Lauro , Cherri , Chere' Coen , cdmunoz@earthlink.net, Carla Cassidy , Anne Dunn , Andrea Boeshaar , Amy K Pitts , Amy Davidson , ROMANCE-L Comments: cc: Wanda Jollymore , Sharon Gillenwater , "Shannon@Dm. Net" , "SCOTT2BETH@aol. com" , "SAS457@aol. com" , Sally and JoEllen , Ruth Scofield Smith , Rob Preece , Richmond Rabbit Ranch , "Richard E. Horton" , Red Domino , Puah , "Petersj@Alltel. Net" , Paula , "PattMarr44@aol. com" , "Patric@Usa. Net" , Patience Smith , Pat Patera , Pat Patera , Pat Minyard , Pat Delk , "Pandc@Swbell. Net" , Pam Schlutt , Pam Schlutt , Pam Ripling , Pam Hillman , Nancy Lockman Shaw , Nancy Brandt , "MoresMemo@aol. com" , "Mopar@Cyberport. Com" , Mom Weaver , Molly Noble Bull , Molly Bull , "MLCVamp@aol. com" , Mindi Bonfanti , Mike and Kim Valentine , Micky , "Michele_Wyan@baylor. edu" , Melody , Melanie Bocek , mbcb@viptx.net, "MBard@aol. com" , Maya Philand , Maureen Pratt , Maureen Gibbins , "Marilyn J. Shank" , Margo , Lynn Coleman , "Lorena K. McCourtney" , Loree Lough , Lois Richer , "Lndooley@Airmail. Net" , "LisaRamagl@aol. com" , Lisa W , Linda Windsor , Linda Goodnight , Lilles Slawik , Leslie Hamilton Tragert , Lena , Leanne Shawler , "Lea@Mobiletel. Com" , "Ldwrites@Safeweb. Net" , "LCHanna@aol. com" , "LBulock@aol. com" , Laura , Ladene , "Kristy646@AOL. COM" , Kristy , Kim Comeaux , Kim Brian , Kim , Kim , Kennet Gencks , Kellesha , "KDTB825@aol. com" , Kathy Velarde , Kathy Greyle , Kathy Earley , Kathleen A Morgan , "Jzimlich@Zebra. Net" , Joan Wallyn , Jewel , Jenny & Mark Ryan , Jenn Vasperam , "Jenn V." , Jen Norris , Jaye n'ha Naomi , Jaye , "JansEMail@aol. com" , Janis Reams Hudson , Janet Barton , Janet Barton , Janet , Janet , Janelle Schneider , Gary & Jean Gray , Gail Sattler , Gail Martin , Gail , Gail , G/H/J/S/D , "Froemkma@Bryan. Edu" , "FROEMKE, MARCY" , "Emberger@Sunlink. Net" , "Emberger@Earth. Sunlink. Net" , Elizabeth & Dan Delisi , "Eileen M. Berger" , Eileen Berger , "Drlynne@Js-Net. Com" , Donna , "Donald V., Sally A. or Tracy M. Thurber" , "Destin1095@aol. com" , "DeeHenderson@worldnet. att. net" , Dee Henderson , Deb Kanster , Deb , DeAnna Bass , Dean Day , Cynthia Tenen , CLAIRE GIPSON , "Cheryl St. John" , Charlotte , Charles Alsbrooks , Carolyne Aarsen , Carolyne Aarsen , Carolyn Greene , Carolyn Aarsen , CarolGP Gift Page , Carole Gift Page , Carol Steward , "Carmic@flash. net" , "Bstseller1@aol. com" , Bruce Adams , Brenda Meyer , Bonnie Jean , Bonnie , "BobbiUp@aol. com" , Bobbi , Bev Huston , "Beki@Upline. Com" , Bek Oberin , Arlene James , Annie Jones ***If I have some of you on this address that should NOT be on it and are NOT interested in romance, please email me at romance@simegen.com and I'll make SURE to take you off. Thank you.*** Join multipublished authors Lenora Nazworth aka Lenora Worth and Deb Kanster as they talk about writing for more than one house. Bring your questions about publishing, what different houses might be looking for, just how you go about selling to more than one house and do you need an agent. They're more than willing to answer any questions. So be sure to make it there. http://www.simegen.com/out-t/romance/chat.html If you've never chatted, check out our faq page. Otherwise, go to the above url at: 9pm EST, 8pm cst, 6pm PST -5 GMT [for our Brisbane friends] and join us as we discover an entirely new side of publishing in the romance industry! For more information on these two wonderful authors, be sure to stop by their webpages. http://www.simegen.com/out-t/romance/1002/ and http://members.aol.com/debwrtr/index.html/ If you have any questions, please contact Deb@crockettnet.com or romance@simegen.com [except if you are on this list by accident--then PLEASE contact romance@simegen.com]. Thanks! Look forward to seeing you there! And please feel free to pass on this information to anyone interested. Everyone is welcomed. Cheryl Wolverton > Risa's Rebel A Mother's Love [April 99] For The Love of Zach [Sept 99]* For The Love of Hawk * *[Hill Creek, Texas Series] DNQ w/o permission or a letter informing of intent please. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- begin 666 winmail.dat M>)\^(CH5`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$& M@ ,`#@```,\'!@`"`! `'@````,`#P$!`Y &`$P*```G````"P`"``$````+ M`",```````,`)@``````"P`I```````#`#8``````!X`< `!````$@```$-H M870@1G)I9&%Y($YI9VAT`````@%Q``$````6`````;ZM/Q/SO8A]'AB]$=.! MJ5!@7L$``````@$=# $````<````4TU44#I#2$5264Q73T!"14Q,4T]55$@N M3D54``L``0X`````0 `&#@`\;Q$_K;X!`@$*#@$````8`````````*N"$H77 M$=,1@:D`2%[!4P+"@ ``"P`?#@$````#``80'8"K,@,`!Q V!0``'@`($ $` M``!E````*BHJ249)2$%615-/345/1EE/54].5$A)4T%$1%)%4U-42$%44TA/ M54Q$3D]40D5/3DE404Y$05)%3D]424Y415)%4U1%1$E.4D]-04Y#12Q03$5! M4T5%34%)3$U%05123TU!3@`````"`0D0`0```,D%``#%!0``80D``$Q:1G40 M`A3(`P`*`')C<&1\(8"(@`Z 7, 0`(&%D+F0=P 01%S!A!4!S: 4(8&P2H$Y/5"!B^R(1`Z!I M!4 `0(L'T97DK(6PL8 &@"& %0.YW!1 NT \@( (0!< $ M8/\E@2.A`Z @42& "& 4$"OQWD(%$#41(F$%P'$*4"90?FD"(",!-',N]34! M)T!W]2.R9 :09B8A`C V5 0@<&UI9V@%0"2A"0!O]FLU!2= :C: .B('X")B M_F%D/"%R>2%&&D;_-58+@#5!`, WTB*4!Y UL>\PX#2P`B $ M@69'(2^5)T#_1(DF4!) )) S\2]06-!7H?YB3E)$$$8?1R](/TE$#T#X,#(O M2C\L]"4Q8K]CPN\'@ ;0!)!$$&$&\&2S`0"68C3 6^ O6Y%E>$GC_V8O2SLA MA$-;)T<%H (P`-!K!4 RD4 %`&]-8!0@=+\@8$#0*9(%L2B?*:%;:M#_)R % M,0:0(E,ED*S[R)@-C$E^"OQ14QA?E17DOYL*9%_(6);"P,,T '!8Q-O M## `0!101<%Y`R Q\&PW3&$K``N0?@,P'^ R($ ^/$E83UDJX"J6/F,35G-2 M! !A)P0@?E(RH#V 3K2$$1525G,\?V,?9" I4&_ -.%B(63"0>UTXG.)@&^A M< ;P! !ET?PS-X:C("2$0!_1%]&%)/V&YT$%T!`(2 "" &``````# ````````1@`` M```WA0```0````$`````````'@"%@ @@!@``````P ```````$8`````.(4` M``$````!``````````L`BX (( 8``````, ```````!&`````(*%```!```` M"P".@ L@!@``````P ```````$8``````(@````````+`)" "R &``````# M````````1@`````%B ````````(!^ \!````$ ```*N"$H77$=,1@:D`2%[! M4P("`?H/`0```! ```"K@A*%UQ'3$8&I`$A>P5,"`@'[#P$```!T```````` M`#BANQ %Y1 :H;L(`"LJ5L(``%!35%!26"Y$3$P``````````$Y)5$'YO[@! M`*H`-]EN````0SI<5TE.1$]74UQ!<'!L:6-A=&EO;B!$871A7$UI8W)O Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Dancer Subject: Packet storms MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We appear to have a touch of bad internet weather between the australian routers and the MCI routers in California. Links are terminally congested, and packet-loss is high to extreme. This in turn is causing unpredictable packet-storms back out into national networks on both sides of the pond. Outlook is overcast and gloomy for now, hoping for clearer weather later once Telstra and MCI stop blaming each-other for the problem and actually start looking to find out where the fault is. Accordingly, access to simegen.com is NOT going to be very good until this clears up, and you may even have some problems with your own networks if you (or your ISP) are in the vicinity of the Los Angeles, Bloomington or Kansas City networks. D ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 13:02:54 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Eliza and Zoe Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Zoe here. Ummm, I'm wondering what this is at the bottom of Cheryl's post. It jammed the computer and i had to reboot. Eliza is not home so I had no idea what else to do. When I got back on it had this. Seeing that there isn't normally attachments on this list i thought it might be important. Can it be sent, not as an attachment? ( Aghhhhhh! Oh dear I hate to think what it's done to my work computer.) > >Attachment Converted: "c:\eudora\attach\winmail3.dat" >MM:!*V#W #U0<3`H!]"H!9",@@.PEO#C U&;]E_0X@.!L#&M$)NQL/'8$8T:T, >M8&,`4 L#<0#@8P$Q*'5L;@(@90NF("I!(1!)9B!)(!/@=EAE(',#<"' ;R%0 >M>1\(8"(@`Z 7, 0`(&%D+F0=P 01%S!A!4!S: 4(8&P2H$Y/5"!B^R(1`Z!I >M!4 `M`Q$B`2/!K2;50 "0!X!G"? N!: B;24C22=L*!%A:Z$AP%-54D4BP&\BP(MM! !H)G%ACG47, 6P!"%B($P)\,4%L&$'L&%Z=PD1%T W*G PD#!%5S#T)4%$ :) ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 13:11:39 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Re: Packet storms MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dancer wrote: > > We appear to have a touch of bad internet weather between the australian > routers and the MCI routers in California. Links are terminally > congested, and packet-loss is high to extreme. This in turn is causing > unpredictable packet-storms back out into national networks on both > sides of the pond. He's serious about the 'weather' analogy - internet congestion behaves very like high and low pressure systems in the atmosphere. Congestion spreads from high 'pressure' areas to low 'pressure' areas, as routers try to find other ways around the jam-up. Anyway - this will clear once the cause of the original congestion is fixed. Meantime, expect lag to any Australian site (this includes simegen.com), and to anywhere else the storms wind up affecting. California is likely to have bad 'weather', for instance. I think there's a Sydney/Seattle link as well, which some routers are likely to use, which means Seattle may get 'overcast'. Jenn V. -- As long as there are ill-defined goals, bizarre bugs, and unrealistic schedules, there will be Real Programmers willing to jump in and Solve The Problem, saving the documentation for later. Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 23:19:13 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Karen Litman Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Zoe wrote: Ummm, I'm wondering what this is at the bottom of Cheryl's post. It jammed the computer and i had to reboot. Eliza is not home so I had no idea what else to do. When I got back on it had this. Seeing that there isn't normally attachments on this list i thought it might be important. Can it be sent, not as an attachment? ( Aghhhhhh! Oh dear I hate to think what it's done to my work computer.) I received the attachment also, in two separate sendings of this message. One was sent to a list of people Cheryl selected, and the other to our listserve. I did NOT download the file whatever it was. Fortunately AOL allows you to take a file or reject it. Karen Litman ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 23:35:01 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Cheryl Wolverton Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night In-Reply-To: Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This was something OFF list. Cheryl Wolverton > Risa's Rebel http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1037 A Mother's Love [April 99] For The Love of Zach [Sept 99]* For The Love of Hawk * *[Hill Creek, Texas Series] http://www.simegen.com/out-t/romance/index.html DNQ w/o permission or a letter informing of intent please. -----Original Message----- From: A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom [mailto:SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM]On Behalf Of Karen Litman Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 1999 10:19 PM To: SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night Zoe wrote: Ummm, I'm wondering what this is at the bottom of Cheryl's post. It jammed the computer and i had to reboot. Eliza is not home so I had no idea what else to do. When I got back on it had this. Seeing that there isn't normally attachments on this list i thought it might be important. Can it be sent, not as an attachment? ( Aghhhhhh! Oh dear I hate to think what it's done to my work computer.) I received the attachment also, in two separate sendings of this message. One was sent to a list of people Cheryl selected, and the other to our listserve. I did NOT download the file whatever it was. Fortunately AOL allows you to take a file or reject it. Karen Litman ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Jun 1999 23:36:45 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Cheryl Wolverton Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19990603130252.00951410@mail.xenon.net> nope, not on the list Zoe. IF it did get the list, then apologies to all. It wasn't to go to the list. But I don't mail attachments--no my email prog isn't set to mail them...so I have no idea what is going on . If anyone else has any questions, please ask me OFF the list and I'll be glad to answer:))) Cheryl Wolverton > Risa's Rebel http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1037 A Mother's Love [April 99] For The Love of Zach [Sept 99]* For The Love of Hawk * *[Hill Creek, Texas Series] http://www.simegen.com/out-t/romance/index.html DNQ w/o permission or a letter informing of intent please. -----Original Message----- From: A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom [mailto:SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM]On Behalf Of Eliza and Zoe Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 1999 10:03 PM To: SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night Zoe here. Ummm, I'm wondering what this is at the bottom of Cheryl's post. It jammed the computer and i had to reboot. Eliza is not home so I had no idea what else to do. When I got back on it had this. Seeing that there isn't normally attachments on this list i thought it might be important. Can it be sent, not as an attachment? ( Aghhhhhh! Oh dear I hate to think what it's done to my work computer.) > >Attachment Converted: "c:\eudora\attach\winmail3.dat" >MM:!*V#W #U0<3`H!]"H!9",@@.PEO#C U&;]E_0X@.!L#&M$)NQL/'8$8T:T, >M8&,`4 L#<0#@8P$Q*'5L;@(@90NF("I!(1!)9B!)(!/@=EAE(',#<"' ;R%0 >M>1\(8"(@`Z 7, 0`(&%D+F0=P 01%S!A!4!S: 4(8&P2H$Y/5"!B^R(1`Z!I >M!4 `M`Q$B`2/!K2;50 "0!X!G"? N!: B;24C22=L*!%A:Z$AP%-54D4BP&\BP(MM! !H)G%ACG47, 6P!"%B($P)\,4%L&$'L&%Z=PD1%T W*G PD#!%5S#T)4%$ :) ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 16:07:31 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Eliza and Zoe Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 23:35 2/06/99 -0500, you wrote: >Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people >attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. > >And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This was >something OFF list. Others also mentioned recieving the attachment. Please check the group address - as the list email (simegen-l@simegen.com) is included on that list. I have recieved it before, but didn't accept the file. Today, as Zoe was here by herself and didn't know what to do, she accepted it. The file is called "winmail.dat" and I assume it is being generated by the email client. I hope that information helps you find the problem. These things happen sometimes with all the different mail clients out there. I wouldn't mind betting that it's something Microsoft has come up with :) If anyone else is having these problems, check your mail client. Eliza ambrov Halwyn Companion to Zoe Farris ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 02:16:59 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Cheryl Wolverton Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19990603160728.009fa100@mail.xenon.net> I'll tell you what it MIGHT be.... I was having problems with my email client and we did a wipe and reinstall. It has given me a problem or two in certain areas. So, that is a possibility why people are suddenly getting weird stuff:/ Or,...and this is a big sigh...I came home a couple of days ago to find my entire system rearranged.....no one was home at the time this happened[yeah, I got in the cache and places to see what was opened when]....so I can only assume someone from outside came inside and reset some things I didn't catch...nothing was missing and I have a good idea who just might wander into my house unannounced w/o permission and feel free to play with my computer and change all of my settings.....so that is a second possibility......mutter. So, I'll do a thorough check and see if I can find out just WHAT the devil is going on if you guys are getting attachments from me. Cheryl Wolverton > Risa's Rebel http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1037 A Mother's Love [April 99] For The Love of Zach [Sept 99]* For The Love of Hawk * *[Hill Creek, Texas Series] http://www.simegen.com/out-t/romance/index.html DNQ w/o permission or a letter informing of intent please. -----Original Message----- From: A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom [mailto:SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM]On Behalf Of Eliza and Zoe Sent: Thursday, June 03, 1999 1:08 AM To: SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night At 23:35 2/06/99 -0500, you wrote: >Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people >attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. > >And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This was >something OFF list. Others also mentioned recieving the attachment. Please check the group address - as the list email (simegen-l@simegen.com) is included on that list. I have recieved it before, but didn't accept the file. Today, as Zoe was here by herself and didn't know what to do, she accepted it. The file is called "winmail.dat" and I assume it is being generated by the email client. I hope that information helps you find the problem. These things happen sometimes with all the different mail clients out there. I wouldn't mind betting that it's something Microsoft has come up with :) If anyone else is having these problems, check your mail client. Eliza ambrov Halwyn Companion to Zoe Farris ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 08:24:12 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Colleen M." Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-06-03 00:34:03 EDT, you write: << Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This was something OFF list. >> Cheryl, your e-mail was sent to the Sime~Gen mailing list; I think we all got it. Also, Karen Litman mentioned getting the attachment and I also received it. I deleted it unread - I generally don't download attachments unless I know what they are. (I tend to get lots of attachments when Jacqueline posts to the list as well - have no idea why!) Colleen ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 09:46:00 -0400 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Farlie Dragon Subject: attachments MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit weird enough, I didn't get anything. Farlie ----- Original Message ----- From: Cheryl Wolverton Sent: Thursday, June 03, 1999 3:16 AM Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night find out just WHAT the devil > is going on if you guys are getting attachments from me. > > Cheryl Wolverton > > Risa's Rebel ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 10:06:53 -0400 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Farlie Dragon Subject: Re: attachments MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I spoke too soon, I found it. it was in my in box not with the list mail for some reason. Farlie ----- Original Message ----- From: Farlie Dragon To: Sent: Thursday, June 03, 1999 9:46 AM Subject: attachments > weird enough, I didn't get anything. > Farlie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Cheryl Wolverton Sent: Thursday, June 03, 1999 3:16 AM > Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night > find out just WHAT the devil > > is going on if you guys are getting attachments from me. > > > > Cheryl Wolverton > > > Risa's Rebel > > ---------- > You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. > To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to > LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text > "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". > ---------- > ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 02:01:34 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Veraik Subject: Copy of HoZ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" If anybody is interested in a copy of HoZ, below is the information. Have a great day and it's great to be back from vacation. Cherri ---------- HOUSE OF ZEOR. by Lichtenberg, Jacqueline. Garden City: Doubleday & Company, Inc. 1974. Octavo, cloth. First edition. The author's first book and first Sime / Gen novel. A fine copy in fine dust jacket. The price of the book is US$ 25.00 Please reference the seller's book # 65001 when ordering. The seller is Currey, L.W. Inc. P.O. Box 187 (Water Street) , Elizabethtown, NY, U.S.A.,12932. Ph: 518-873-6477. Fax: 518-873-9105. Terms of sale: ALL ITEMS are subject to prior sale. Items may be reserved by telephone, fax, or e-mail. Available items will be held for 7 days pending receipt of payment or submission of credit account details. To help us identify your requested items, your inquiry/order should include the item identification number, as well as author, title, and list price. REMITTANCE: Payment by check or money order in U.S. funds should accompany your order, institutions excepted. Institutions may receive deferred billing uponrequest. SALES TAX: New York State residents should remit appropriate sales tax for their tax district. The tax should be calculated on the total purchase price, including postage charges. Tax exempt New York State booksellers must supply a valid Resale Certificate with their identification number, or the appropriate tax for their district will be added to the purchase price. PURCHASES MAY BE CHARGED: We offer services of two major credit card systems: VISA and MASTERCARD. If you wish to use either of these cards to make purchases via mail, telephone, fax, or e-mail please provide the following data at the time of your order: (1) the name of the cardholder exactly as it appears on your card, (2) your card number, and (3) the expiration date of your card. Minimum credit card charge: $20.00. SHIPPING: Cost of shipment is charged on all orders. Standard shipping charge is: $5.00 for the first book, $1.00 for each additional book combined in a single multiple book order. Unless otherwise instructed, all domestic (U.S.) orders are shipped via U.P.S. ground service and are fully insured at our expense. U.S.P.S priority mail service can be used in place of U.P.S. ground service upon request. Non-domestic orders are shipped via U.S.P.S. printed matter (surface) rate and cannot be insured. Uninsured airmail shipping via U.S.P.S AO Mail rate (weight limit four pounds per parcel) is available for non-domestic orders upon request at addi http://dogbert.abebooks.com/abe/OrderInsert?ph=1&bi=23434071 This mail was created 6/1/1999 5:21:43 AM and postmarked 6/1/1999 5:37:25 AM. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 07:16:53 +0100 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Sheila Clark Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night In-Reply-To: <000b01bead7a$72038040$56ca4dd8@cherylwo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain In article <000b01bead7a$72038040$56ca4dd8@cherylwo>, Cheryl Wolverton wrote: > Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people > attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. > And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This > was something OFF list. I got an attachment which I didn't try to access. Sheila -- sheilac@argonet.co.uk I am not young enough to know everything - J M Barrie ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 11:11:48 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Kiri Aradia Morgan Subject: the attachment mystery In-Reply-To: <490c3d116fsheilac@argonet.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 3 Jun 1999, Sheila Clark wrote: > In article <000b01bead7a$72038040$56ca4dd8@cherylwo>, > Cheryl Wolverton wrote: > > Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people > > attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. > > > And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This > > was something OFF list. > > I got an attachment which I didn't try to access. > Some email programs send the mail as plaintext and then send another copy of it as an HTML attachment. If that's the case, Cheryl, you didn't mean to send an attach, but your mailer sent it out for you. What software are you using? Outlook has a real bad habit of pulling this stunt. Kiri ****************************************************************************** Kiri Aradia Morgan 93! Thou Art God tiamat@tsoft.com "If time passes, everything turns into beauty If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away Everything starts wearing fresh colors Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic Desire is embraced in a dream..." -- X-JAPAN ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 22:39:44 GMT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jeff Zeitlin Organization: None To Speak Of Subject: Re: Attachment (was: Re: Chat Friday Night) In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable WINMAIL.DAT is a file that Microsoft's free email program, Outhouse Distress, attaches to email messages in seemingly random fashion. It's not a virus, and if I recall aright, it contains information that other installations of OE can use to make the incoming message "real purty". I know that there is a way to remove it, but since I don't use OE, not what that method is. -- Jeff Zeitlin jzeitlin@cyburban.com ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 17:39:43 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Cheryl Wolverton Subject: Re: the attachment mystery In-Reply-To: Kiri...thank you! I have it on Plain Text...I'm using Outlook...I glanced through but didn't see anything in it that said to send an attachment...shen I hate it when that happens! Any idea whre to specifically look? mutter grumble I HATE getting attachments and RARELY send them...this ticks me off royally that you guys are being spammed by me! Cheryl Wolverton > Risa's Rebel http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1037 A Mother's Love [April 99] For The Love of Zach [Sept 99]* For The Love of Hawk * *[Hill Creek, Texas Series] http://www.simegen.com/out-t/romance/index.html DNQ w/o permission or a letter informing of intent please. -----Original Message----- From: A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom [mailto:SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM]On Behalf Of Kiri Aradia Morgan Sent: Thursday, June 03, 1999 1:12 PM To: SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM Subject: the attachment mystery On Thu, 3 Jun 1999, Sheila Clark wrote: > In article <000b01bead7a$72038040$56ca4dd8@cherylwo>, > Cheryl Wolverton wrote: > > Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people > > attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. > > > And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This > > was something OFF list. > > I got an attachment which I didn't try to access. > Some email programs send the mail as plaintext and then send another copy of it as an HTML attachment. If that's the case, Cheryl, you didn't mean to send an attach, but your mailer sent it out for you. What software are you using? Outlook has a real bad habit of pulling this stunt. Kiri **************************************************************************** ** Kiri Aradia Morgan 93! Thou Art God tiamat@tsoft.com "If time passes, everything turns into beauty If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away Everything starts wearing fresh colors Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic Desire is embraced in a dream..." -- X-JAPAN ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 17:41:21 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Cheryl Wolverton Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night In-Reply-To: <62562663.2487cdec@aol.com> AGH! My profuse apologies to the LIST! AGH AGH AGH! I feel like Jar Jar right now after sticking his head in the um...well...don't want to spoil the movie. What an IDIOT thing of me to do. SIgh. Thanks for your patience dear ones. Cheryl Wolverton > Risa's Rebel http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1037 A Mother's Love [April 99] For The Love of Zach [Sept 99]* For The Love of Hawk * *[Hill Creek, Texas Series] http://www.simegen.com/out-t/romance/index.html DNQ w/o permission or a letter informing of intent please. -----Original Message----- From: A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom [mailto:SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM]On Behalf Of Colleen M. Sent: Thursday, June 03, 1999 7:24 AM To: SIMEGEN-L@SIMEGEN.COM Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night In a message dated 99-06-03 00:34:03 EDT, you write: << Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This was something OFF list. >> Cheryl, your e-mail was sent to the Sime~Gen mailing list; I think we all got it. Also, Karen Litman mentioned getting the attachment and I also received it. I deleted it unread - I generally don't download attachments unless I know what they are. (I tend to get lots of attachments when Jacqueline posts to the list as well - have no idea why!) Colleen ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 09:30:05 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Dancer Subject: NatWest, InterTrust Create Micro Currency System For Net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NatWest, InterTrust Create Micro Currency System For Net International bank NatWest Group and encryption company InterTrust Technologies unveiled an e-commerce service today that offers digital copyright protection through the collection and processing of "micro" payments. The service, known as Magex, provides protection for digital goods sold over the Internet such as music, books, games and business reports, the bank said. Internet users wanting to download the latest Bruce Springsteen album or a business report from Dun & Bradstreet can access them through "DigiBox," an encrypted container that enables the companies that own the rights to the content to govern its price and usage. The customers are then charged a fee, to be determined by the copyright owners and content providers, in exchange for the content. The payment system works like a debit card, said Jon Boroshok, a spokesman for the two companies. As part of NatWest, the Magex service will be able to route payments from the consumers to the content providers using the bank's core processing systems, thereby opening up new revenue streams for content providers, Boroshok told Newsbytes. The Magex service combines encryption technology from Sunnyvale, Calif.-based InterTrust Technologies Corp. with NatWest's financial clearinghouse. On the seller side, businesses receive Magex software and package their content into the DigiBox container, which in turn encrypts the information for secure release over the Internet. On the buyer side, consumers receive Magex software that opens the DigiBox container and gives them access and payment options. "It's persistent protection," Boroshok said. Boroshok said the company is working with Reuters, Dun & Bradstreet and Equifax on pilot versions of the service. It is scheduled to be fully available by October, he said. Boroshok didn't say whether any members of the recording industry, which has been vehemently fighting the MP3 software evolution, have enlisted the Magex service. MP3 compresses songs from compact discs into files that can be downloaded easily from the Internet. Some users illegally have posted free copies of tunes by popular artists. The recording industry says pirated songs steal revenue from artists and record labels. MP3 advocates say that downloads promote artists and that piracy complaints are an excuse to delay releasing music on the Net until labels devise their own downloading systems. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 20:01:33 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Ann Partridge Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 6/3/99 12:34:03 AM Eastern Daylight Time, cherylwo@BELLSOUTH.NET writes: << Well, that is really interesting, considering I DO NOT send people attachments and no one else has mentioned getting an attachment. And I did not send it to the list, for those of you on this list. This was something OFF list. >> I don't think I am on the romance list, but I received the same e-mail as Zoe. I had attachments but did not open them. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 11:00:06 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Re: Chat Friday Night MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cheryl Wolverton wrote: > > AGH! > > My profuse apologies to the LIST! AGH AGH AGH! I feel like Jar Jar right > now after sticking his head in the um...well...don't want to spoil the > movie. What an IDIOT thing of me to do. It's not your fault, Cheryl. Now when you do something that IS your fault... Jenn V. -- As long as there are ill-defined goals, bizarre bugs, and unrealistic schedules, there will be Real Programmers willing to jump in and Solve The Problem, saving the documentation for later. Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 19:24:27 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Kiri Aradia Morgan Subject: Re: the attachment mystery In-Reply-To: <000901beae11$f946db00$6ace4cd8@cherylwo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Thu, 3 Jun 1999, Cheryl Wolverton wrote: > Kiri...thank you! > > I have it on Plain Text...I'm using Outlook...I glanced through but didn't > see anything in it that said to send an attachment...shen I hate it when > that happens! > > Any idea whre to specifically look? mutter grumble I HATE getting > attachments and RARELY send them...this ticks me off royally that you guys > are being spammed by me! > I don't know, but I'll look. I have Outlook, but I don't use it because I don't like it much. I prefer pine on my shell acct and Netscape Mail for everything else, but I have to learn Outlook to please a potential employer this week, so when I do that, I'll let you know what I find out. Kiri ****************************************************************************** Kiri Aradia Morgan 93! Thou Art God tiamat@tsoft.com "If time passes, everything turns into beauty If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away Everything starts wearing fresh colors Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic Desire is embraced in a dream..." -- X-JAPAN ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 11:06:52 +0000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Marge Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT Another article and story posted to Rimon's Library MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've just posted The case of the STalking Sime by Tracy Ann Murry. http://www.simegen.com/in-t/rimonslibrary/coss21.html. This is an interesting Sime~Gen whodonit from Ambrov Zeor #21 I also posted Roots of Zeor a two part article that I put together years ago from correspondance between Jean Lorrah and JL regarding the developement of First Channel. http://www.simegen.com/in-t/rimonslibrary/articles/roz17.html This appeared in AZ17 and AZ18. Marge -- *********************************************************** Marge@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/in-t/virtualtecton/Householding/chanel/ http://www.simegen.com/in-t/rimonslibrary/ http://www.simegen.com/in-t/virtualtecton/sghistory/ *********************************************************** ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 12:49:41 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Colleen Maynard Subject: 2 Quick Questions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hi all - I'm subbed from work again. You'll notice it's a new address - that's because it's a new job. I finally quit at the law firm I'd been working at (for a little over two years) and am now working at an architectural firm just a few blocks from my home. So far - I've been here four days - I like it a lot. Very friendly atmosphere, interesting place to work. We use Microsoft Outlook here, which is one reason I'm sending this out. I've set my mail to plain text, but I know that sometimes Outlook sends weird stuff (HTML copies and odd attachments) anyway. Would y'all please let me know if I'm sending out anything but readable, plain text postings without attachments? Also - would someone please repost the URL for that James Kirk (Star Trek) search engine that was posted a few weeks ago? I had to completely reinstall AOL two nights ago (not bad - the first time in 3 1/2 years that it quit working entirely!) and of course my husband and I lost all our Favorite Places. Back to square one. Thanks, everyone! Colleen M. (aka distect@aol.com) ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 11:08:27 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Tony Zbaraschuk Subject: Re: 2 Quick Questions In-Reply-To: from "Colleen Maynard" at Jun 4, 99 12:49:41 pm Content-Type: text Colleen wrote: > We use Microsoft Outlook here, which is one reason I'm sending this out. > I've set my mail to plain text, but I know that sometimes Outlook sends > weird stuff (HTML copies and odd attachments) anyway. Would y'all > please let me know if I'm sending out anything but readable, plain text > postings without attachments? > Plain text, looks great. Tony Z ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 03:21:49 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Books & printing.. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >From The Melbourne Age: Taking a leaf out of books By TIM WINKLER Tired of that fruitless chase for a book lapsed from print? Worry no more. Bookshops are installing new technology that will enable them to print and bind a fresh copy of your favorite book in a few minutes. Welcome to the virtual bookshop, with literally bottomless shelves. America's second-largest bookstore chain, Borders Group, last week teamed up with an Atlanta technology company, Sprout, to develop a network of instant book production facilities in all Borders stores, including one at South Yarra's Jam Factory. So far, Sprout has 1300 titles in its digital library, but expects to acquire thousands more. Once the system is established, customers will be able to browse electronically for books not in store. They can then download the title, printing the cover on a color printer and pages on a separate black and white machine. The components will be assembled in a book binder using the same process used in regular production. A spokeswoman for Sprout, Ms Ashley Gordon, said a book would be produced in 15 minutes, at a similar cost to traditionally manufactured paperbacks. Pages would only be black and white, however. ``I don't see this process replacing mass production of books. This is a supplement to the other ways of moving books from one place to another. Sprout is simply a wholesaler. ``This is a way for a small bookstore to have more inventory without adding more space,'' she said. But because of the black and white printing, Ms Gordon said the technology would not be suitable for children's books, or those with a lot of color plates. A Borders Group spokeswoman, Ms Ann Binkley, said rather than ending the life of book-lined shelves in bookstores, the technology would complement existing stocks. Retailers would be able to clear their shelves of slow-moving titles and the number of books returned to publishers after unsuccessful sales campaigns would be reduced. ``There are a lot of out-of-print titles which we don't carry any more and the system will enable us to get these books into the customers' hands. For us, it also means more obscure titles won't get stuck on the shelf,'' she said. Installation of the system in stores may take a few years. Borders Group has acquired a 20 per cent stake in Sprout, but Sprout hopes to spread the technology to other book retailers in the future. Multinational publishers said about 25 per cent of book titles classified as in print were not officially in production, and this system would be ideal for making those available. As a result, several hundred thousand titles, including slow-selling academic books, lesser-known classics, and recently discontinued favorites, are likely to become available. -- As long as there are ill-defined goals, bizarre bugs, and unrealistic schedules, there will be Real Programmers willing to jump in and Solve The Problem, saving the documentation for later. Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 14:11:42 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Karen Litman Subject: Re: Books & printing.. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jenn wrote: From The Melbourne Age: Taking a leaf out of books By TIM WINKLER Tired of that fruitless chase for a book lapsed from print? Worry no more. Bookshops are installing new technology that will enable them to print and bind a fresh copy of your favorite book in a few minutes. >> Saw the poster for this service at Borders a few days ago. The only problem I see with this is that the author of the book does not get paid for the copy produced. Or do they? --- Karen Litman ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 04:22:02 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Re: Books & printing.. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Karen Litman wrote: > > Saw the poster for this service at Borders a few days ago. The only problem > I see with this is that the author of the book does not get paid for the copy > produced. Or do they? --- Karen Litman I'd imagine it'd be breach of copyright to do this with any book still covered by copyright, unless the author is duly approached & a contract is signed. Jenn V. -- As long as there are ill-defined goals, bizarre bugs, and unrealistic schedules, there will be Real Programmers willing to jump in and Solve The Problem, saving the documentation for later. Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Jun 1999 21:05:42 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: Books & printing.. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 02:11 PM 06/05/1999 EDT, Karen wrote: >Jenn wrote: > Worry no more. Bookshops are installing new technology >that > will enable them to print and bind a fresh copy of your >favorite > book in a few minutes. >> > >Saw the poster for this service at Borders a few days ago. The only problem >I see with this is that the author of the book does not get paid for the copy >produced. Or do they? If they own the copyright, they do. Otherwise printing their books on this system would be illegal. What is bad for authors is that Borders will want exclusive rights, while Ingram's Insta-Print (same thing) will want exclusive rights, while Somebody Else Who Decides to Go Into This Business will want exclusive rights--and the author will have to try to determine which one will win five-ten years down the line. And you can bet that NONE of these books-on-demand companies will have the least interest in reprinting midlist books by non-award-winning authors. Jean >---------- >You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. >To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to >LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text >"unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". >---------- > Contents of this e-mail are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 17:01:10 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: theresa sorrell Subject: OT: Humor Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: Quoted-Printable MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) I got these from Skydancer. A young lady with a slightly warped sense of humor. There is a lot of truth in most of these Starsinger Fwd: Great One-Liners One Liners =A0-Smile, it's the second best thing you can do with your lips. =A0-Sex is like air, it's not important unless you aren't getting any. =A0-Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyways. =A0-If vegetable oil is made of vegetables, what is baby oil made of? =A0-No guts, no glory, no brain, same story. =A0-Cocaine is gods way of telling you that you make too much money. =A0-If quiters never win, and winners never cheat, then who is the fool who =A0 =A0 =A0 said "Quit while you're ahead"? =A0-If you don't die from it -- it is healthy. =A0-If everything is going well, you don't know what the hell is Going on. =A0-One good turn gets most of the blankets. =A0-It is better to be looked over than overlooked. =A0-There are three kinds of people -- those who can count and those who can't. =A0-It is not what a teenager knows that bothers his parents, it is how he =A0 =A0 =A0 found out. =A0-My homework is like a juicy steak -- rarely done. =A0-There are two kinds of pedestrians -- the quick and the dead. =A0-Life is sexually transmitted. =A0-Everybody wants to go to heaven, but nobody wants to die. =A0-An unbreakable toy is useful for breaking other toys. =A0-If at first you don't succeed -- give up! No use being a damn fool. =A0-Falling in love is awfully simple. Falling out of love is simply awful. =A0-No job is so simple that is can't be done wrong. =A0-You can only be young once, but you can be immature forever. =A0-Only adults have difficulty with childproof bottles. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 18:53:44 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Ann Marie Olson Subject: A curious question. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I know and I am sure that most of us here know that simes won't eat meat becuase they don't like eating something that is now dead and was once alive. (and moving around I suppose, given that they will eat dead plants and animal products such as eggs, cheese and milk) But will they eat live things? Such as oysters, some crawfish, eels etc? (and I do know that all of those are definately -not- kosher) There are a number of water creatures eaten in different cultures alive. (even though Dio says to chew eels vigorously so they don't wiggle after being swallowed) I myself have never tried any of these but most likely would given the chance as long as it doesn't move away too quickly. Of course some cultures also eat blood products from still living animals as well but I figure -that- would be right out of the question. :) (besides, I won't eat most blood based foods either, like blutwurst or the milk/clotted blood mixture the Masai adore) Ann Marie Olson ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 12:01:45 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Re: A curious question. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ann Marie Olson wrote: > Ann Marie Olson > zones> Yeah, but right on lunchtime in Melbourne. :) Jenn V. -- As long as there are ill-defined goals, bizarre bugs, and unrealistic schedules, there will be Real Programmers willing to jump in and Solve The Problem, saving the documentation for later. Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 12:08:09 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Eliza and Zoe Subject: Re: A curious question. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 18:53 7/06/99 -0700, you wrote: > >Ann Marie Olson >zones> Yeah - and right on lunch time here in Australia!!! JL commented on this once while she was on irc - beats me if I can remember, but we must have archieved it SOMEWHERE. I think that CptButton was on during it, and that Cheryl came on during it also. Does anyone remember the occasion, and if we archieved the conversation somewhere? Eliza ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 19:45:15 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Kiri Aradia Morgan Subject: Re: A curious question. In-Reply-To: <199906080159.VAA01786@smtp1.vnet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Ann Marie Olson wrote: > But will they eat live things? Such as oysters, some crawfish, eels etc? > (and I do know that all of those are definately -not- kosher) There are > a number of water creatures eaten in different cultures alive. (even > though Dio says to chew eels vigorously so they don't wiggle after > being swallowed) I myself have never tried any of these but most likely > would given the chance as long as it doesn't move away too quickly. > Hmmm. I have never tried it either. Most food situations don't squick me, though I once got greenish when I was talking about how much I love sparrows "as cute creatures to feed and observe" and Hiroshi thought I meant "as a snack" and agreed with great gusto. However, I think that having it move about in your esophagus could be unpleasant. > Of course some cultures also eat blood products from still living animals > as well but I figure -that- would be right out of the question. :) > (besides, I won't eat most blood based foods either, like blutwurst or > the milk/clotted blood mixture the Masai adore) > Stuff like that generally makes me nauseous even if I am NOT told what it is -- so it must not be psychological. > zones> > Ah, but I got home late and haven't eaten yet. (I hate being hungry and not knowing what I want to eat.) Kiri ****************************************************************************** Kiri Aradia Morgan 93! Thou Art God tiamat@tsoft.com "If time passes, everything turns into beauty If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away Everything starts wearing fresh colors Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic Desire is embraced in a dream..." -- X-JAPAN ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 22:47:58 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Karen Litman Subject: Re: A curious question. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Answering this using CZ#11 for the response. (page 52, November 1994) the last paper issue we ever produced. There were a number of recipes considered for our "Householding Hints" column which Jacqueline commented on regarding Simes and foodstuffs. Unless her opinion has changed over the years, I think I would let this stand. ----- Karen Litman "In general use NO ANIMAL derived products until the days of Space Travel. The problem with eggs is protein. Adult Simes before Klarion's time _lose_ the ability to digest animal protein. They _live on_ selyn and use chemicals only to replace cells, not to produce energy. So between Klyd and Digen the Simes learn to extend lifespan with careful nutrition based on vegetable protein. After Digen, science comes up with waysto sustain the digestive system after changeover and thus extend lifespan for Simes. But it is a DIFFICULT regimen. So eggs and milk are used and regarded by Simes differently at different times. Animal flesh NEVER becomes acceptable to non-junct Simes. Juncts reject it because they can't digest it -- Juncts STOP EATING (for the most part) and die 5 to 15 years past changeover. Juncts nibble for pleasure -- not nutrition!" --------------- Ann Marie Olson wrote: I know and I am sure that most of us here know that simes won't eat meat becuase they don't like eating something that is now dead and was once alive. (and moving around I suppose, given that they will eat dead plants and animal products such as eggs, cheese and milk) But will they eat live things? Such as oysters, some crawfish, eels etc? (and I do know that all of those are definately -not- kosher) There are a number of water creatures eaten in different cultures alive. (even though Dio says to chew eels vigorously so they don't wiggle after being swallowed) I myself have never tried any of these but most likely would given the chance as long as it doesn't move away too quickly. Of course some cultures also eat blood products from still living animals as well but I figure -that- would be right out of the question. :) (besides, I won't eat most blood based foods either, like blutwurst or the milk/clotted blood mixture the Masai adore) ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 19:57:55 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Tony Zbaraschuk Subject: Re: A curious question. In-Reply-To: <58b9bad2.248dde5e@aol.com> from "Karen Litman" at Jun 7, 99 10:47:58 pm Content-Type: text It was written: > Answering this using CZ#11 for the response. (page 52, November 1994) the > last paper issue we ever produced. There were a number of recipes considered > for our "Householding Hints" column which Jacqueline commented on regarding > Simes and foodstuffs. Unless her opinion has changed over the years, I think > I would let this stand. > ----- Karen Litman > > "In general use NO ANIMAL derived products until the days of Space Travel. > The problem with eggs is protein. Adult Simes before Klarion's time _lose_ > the ability to digest animal protein. They _live on_ selyn and use chemicals > only to replace cells, not to produce energy. Actually, it doesn't really work this way: proteins (well, broken down into amino acids) are what build cells; carbohydrates and fat provide energy. (Radically simplified: the body is a machine that fuels itself with glucose, which it burns with oxygen to create carbon dioxide, and everything else it uses to repair and replenish itself.) > Animal flesh NEVER becomes acceptable to non-junct Simes. Juncts reject it > because they can't digest it -- Juncts STOP EATING (for the most part) and > die 5 to 15 years past changeover. Juncts nibble for pleasure -- not > nutrition!" Juncts dying 5-15 years after changeover basically means that there's almost no generational continuity -- by the time the kids are old enough to learn, the parents are already dead. I'm having trouble figuring out how you get a society stable enough to have, say, Genfarms under those circumstances -- though I suspect that, like Syrus Farris and Abel Verrit, there will be Simes who have semi-decent nutrition, and that these people will be the core of any existing society. Tony Z ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 22:50:27 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: A curious question. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 06:53 PM 06/07/1999 -0700, Ann Marie wrote: >Hello, > >I know and I am sure that most of us here know that simes won't eat meat >becuase they don't like eating something that is now dead and was once >alive. (and moving around I suppose, given that they will eat dead plants >and animal products such as eggs, cheese and milk) > >But will they eat live things? Such as oysters, some crawfish, eels etc? No, because they cannot metabolize that kind of protein. They _can_ metabolize the protein in eggs and cheese, soybeans, etc. >(and I do know that all of those are definately -not- kosher) There are >a number of water creatures eaten in different cultures alive. (even >though Dio says to chew eels vigorously so they don't wiggle after >being swallowed) I myself have never tried any of these but most likely >would given the chance as long as it doesn't move away too quickly. It's not a religious or cultural rule. It's biology. Probably, if he were undernourished enough, a Sime could eat chicken soup that was heavy on veggies and noodles, and his body would just discard the meat protein in the broth (he wouldn't actually eat the meat)--but if he managed to eat a fair-sized chunk of meat (which would taste awful to him), it would make him sick. In-T kids _do_ have a cultural bias against eating meat; they are likely to stay vegetarian even if they establish and move to Gen Territory. Changeover does affect the sense of taste and smell. Meat becomes repellant. However, appeal is not a good measure of safety--strawberries, for example, remain just as appealing, and Simes have to _know_ they are poisonous. While I was in France, a renSime character introduced himself to me--Reeon ambrov Dar, a great-grandson of Tonyo Logan. (Tonyo got around--if anybody was the literal genetic "father" of Unity, it was Tonyo!) Reeon loves strawberries (that's what attracted him--the fabulous strawberries we were eating). Since he can't eat them, he likes to zlin Gens eating them. Non-Householding Simes would be horrified, even in Reeon's day (around the time of _RenSime_), but not only did he have strawberries as a treat as a child, but he also grew up expecting to establish, and instead changed over--so he feels somewhat cheated. Did I mention that, despite his Dar upbringing, Reeon is a hedonist at heart? >Of course some cultures also eat blood products from still living animals >as well but I figure -that- would be right out of the question. :) >(besides, I won't eat most blood based foods either, like blutwurst or >the milk/clotted blood mixture the Masai adore) Simes can't metabolize raw meat any better than cooked meat. Jean Contents of this e-mail are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. --->****June 20-28, 1999, reach me at Jean1@Juno.com****<--- Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 00:00:08 EDT Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Karen Litman Subject: Re: A curious question. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Only passed along the information I had available which is from 1994. Jean and Jacqueline are the only ones that can tell you if their opinion has changed on the food matters. As far as any of the stories go.... That's also up to them. Both Jacqueline and I read "Doubtful Document" before it went on CZ's site. I think Anne Pinzow read it as well. I don't remember Jacqueline commenting AGAINST the use of the foods in it. Karen ----------- Hello Karen, I would like to very gently and respectfully point out a major canon glitch then in "The Dilemma of the Doubtful Document" as Mary Lou Mendem has simes eating cream of onion soup. (There is also a mention in there I think of eating cheese) For some reason I seem to want to think of butter showing up in Ambrov Keon as well, but there I might very well be mistaken. Ann Marie Olson >> ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 08:42:40 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: A curious question. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Simes are human. Some metabolism changes occur at changeover, and some don't. It would be contrary to survival for Simes to be unable to utilize _any_ kind of protein, animal or vegetable--in that case the bodies of those who took care of themselves would wear out just as fast as those of Raiders. With no way to replace worn-out cells, Simes would all die within seven years of changeover, no exceptions. What _I_ always thought the dairy product thing had to do with is the common problem in Ancients: you don't use it, you lose it. Many adult Ancients develop intolerance to milk because they stop drinking it at adolescence. If they stay off it long enough, if they try to go back to it they get sick. _But_, most Ancients can eat cheese and yogurt with no problem because of the enzymes in these products that have already done the part of the digestive process the person who has gone off milk has lost. I assume that what happens to Simes is that either changeover immediately produces that kind of intolerance, or because of the rapid continuing changes during First Year, by the end of that time the young Sime has developed such an intolerance if not made to drink milk daily. But most Simes (except those with total lactose intolerance, something it turns out Farrises, by some miracle _don't_ have) can digest cheese and yogurt perfectly well, as well as milk as an ingredient in baked goods, chocolate, etc. It's Mairus, if I remember correctly, that Jacqueline says is a connoisseur of cheese. And Hilo Klyd, as we know, is a glutton for chocolate. So I think over the years she has moderated the speculation Karen found in that early fanzine, as the universe has grown. After all, if you are going to posit a Sime society capable of creating the pen system, a government, a family structure of some kind, then you _have_ to have a way for Simes to live more than four or five years after changeover. And that requires nutrition. What you _don't_ have in the days when that Sime society is developing is any kind of scientific establishment. No way are Simes busy developing special strains of soybeans with Sime-digestible protein! Simes are not farming at all, except Genfarming, until _after_ they have established Sime Territories--but they can't establish Sime society in order to establish Sime Territories until they have long enough lives to make it worth the bother. So that means there has to be _easy_ and _fast_ agriculture that produces protein Simes can metabolize. Steal a milk cow from a Gen farm (not a Genfarm, a Gen farm), and voila! You've got instant dairy products. Steal a few chickens, and you've got eggs. And if you have to abandon them and run, you can later steal some more. Until you have a stable Sime society, you do not spend months tending an immovable and indefensible field of soybeans. So no, Simes were not unable to digest any kind of protein until nearly the space age! It just won't work logically, and it obviously didn't take Jacqueline very long to realize that. Jean At 12:00 AM 06/08/1999 EDT, Karen wrote: >Only passed along the information I had available which is from 1994. > >Jean and Jacqueline are the only ones that can tell you if their opinion has >changed on the food matters. As far as any of the stories go.... That's >also up to them. Both Jacqueline and I read "Doubtful Document" before it >went on CZ's site. I think Anne Pinzow read it as well. I don't remember >Jacqueline commenting AGAINST the use of the foods in it. > >Karen > >----------- > Hello Karen, > > I would like to very gently and respectfully point out a major canon glitch > then in "The Dilemma of the > Doubtful Document" as Mary Lou Mendem has simes eating cream of onion soup. > (There is also > a mention in there I think of eating cheese) For some reason I seem to want > to think of butter showing > up in Ambrov Keon as well, but there I might very well be mistaken. > > Ann Marie Olson > > >> > >---------- >You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. >To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to >LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text >"unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". >---------- > Contents of this e-mail are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. --->****June 20-28, 1999, reach me at Jean1@Juno.com****<--- Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 07:45:38 -0800 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Mary Lou Mendum Subject: Re: A curious question. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >>I know and I am sure that most of us here know that simes won't eat meat >>becuase they don't like eating something that is now dead and was once >>alive. (and moving around I suppose, given that they will eat dead plants >>and animal products such as eggs, cheese and milk) >> >>But will they eat live things? Such as oysters, some crawfish, eels etc? > >No, because they cannot metabolize that kind of protein. They _can_ >metabolize the protein in eggs and cheese, soybeans, etc. Biologically, this is nonsense. Meat and vegetable proteins are made of the same stuff and are metabolized the same way by the same enzymes. Eggs and cheese contain the same animal proteins as meat. So whatever the reason Simes don't eat meat, it can't be the digestibility of animal protein. As I pointed out not too long ago, the main difference between animal and vegetable proteins is that on average, the vegetable proteins are much less concentrated and accessable, due to the fact that plant cells have tough, indigestible cell walls made of cellulose. So, any digestive system that can use plant protein can use animal protein more efficiently. My personal hypothesis is that the human digestive system does not adapt very well to the very small amounts of food that Simes consume. Even well-nourished Simes would be permanently on the edge of painful constipation. So, the greater bulk and roughage of a vegetarian diet would be essential for long-term health. Also, if Simes do not process fat very well because they don't use it as fuel, the extra fat content of meat (and avocados, nuts, olives, and other oily foods) would remain undigested for gut bacteria to feed on, causing the same sort of nasty side effects as some of the more drastic diet drugs. This would not account for the psychological aspect of meat-rejection found among Simes, but a cultural truth that "meat is an unwholesome food", reinforced by painful stomach cramps among out-T refugees who try it during the flexibility of First Year, and you could have Simes getting instantly sick at the thought of eating meat. In-T Gens would share this reaction, even though they are perfectly capable of digesting meat. Just as many Westerners get nauseated at eating perfectly healthy, nutritious foods like insect larvae. Mary Lou ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 08:01:20 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Olson, Ann Marie" Subject: Re: A small funny MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hello, > While I was in France, a renSime character introduced himself to > me--Reeon ambrov Dar, a great-grandson of Tonyo Logan. (Tonyo got > around--if > anybody was the literal genetic "father" of Unity, it was Tonyo!) [AMO] ... in the unpublishable Shattered Diamonds, I let my characters just run loose and ran across 'another possible decendent'. Actually I am rather glad the piece is not releasable ... not only does it heavily reference stuff from the Zhag and Tonyo discussions, one of the protags is a very non-standard Ferris. I would have hours of discussion trying to get it through canon restrictions, as well as the fact that I am still very uncomfortable referring to things that are yours or JL's, without first going through repeatedly asking 'it is ok?'. (why the character is only a possible, not a definate) Ann Marie ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 11:00:06 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Colleen Maynard Subject: Re: A curious question. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Mary Lou wrote: <> I grinned at this - my husband has told me several stories about giving survival training instruction in the Marines. They'd teach the guys not just which flora are edible, but also which fauna - and "fauna" includes grubs and maggots, among other things. He said some guys were so revolted at the thought of eating grubs, etc. that they would go for two or three days without eating before hunger made them give in. Some of the stuff Mike's eaten, both in survival training and while being stationed overseas, are things I wouldn't willingly eat unless nothing else is available. (But I'm not one of those people that say, "Eww, I'd *never* eat anything like that! Eww! I'd starve!" No I wouldn't - I hate being really hungry and besides my sense of self-preservation is too strong. I hate touching live fish, for example, but if it was a choice between fishing and going hungry, I'd fish - not a problem!) Some of his stories are very funny - Mike is a great story teller; too bad his storytelling is confined to friends and family. Colleen ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 10:09:04 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Olson, Ann Marie" Subject: Re: Timing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hello, > > Ann Marie Olson > > > zones> > > > > Yeah, but right on lunchtime in Melbourne. :) [AMO] Sorry. I -did- state N. America ... just what is the time differential between California and Melbourne? They locked us out of the clock in 'NT here at work so I can't just look it up easily, and I forgot to last night. Ann Marie ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 10:19:13 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Olson, Ann Marie" Subject: Re: A curious question. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hello, > > > >But will they eat live things? Such as oysters, some crawfish, eels etc? > > No, because they cannot metabolize that kind of protein. They _can_ > metabolize the protein in eggs and cheese, soybeans, etc. [AMO] I would think though that live critters wouldn't be as repellant to their 'delicate sensiblities' insofar as being around them, say something a gen was eating, as the smell of 'dead animal' isn't there. In a snarky moment I had an image of a Companion eating live eels and letting them wiggle just to disturb every sime in the vicinity. (not that they would ever do such a thing ... just me being difficult) Ann Marie ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 10:26:22 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Margaret Carr Subject: Re: Timing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 17 hours, allowing for U.S. Daylight Savings Time, according to burbs. So it is already Tomorrow in Melbourne. http://www.burbs.com/fcgi-bin/tzconvert.fcgi ----- Original Message ----- From: Olson, Ann Marie To: Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 1999 10:09 AM Subject: Re: Timing > Hello, > > > > Ann Marie Olson > > > > > zones> > > > > > > > > Yeah, but right on lunchtime in Melbourne. :) > [AMO] > Sorry. > > I -did- state N. America ... just what is the time differential between > California and Melbourne? They locked us out of the clock in 'NT here at > work so I can't just look it up easily, and I forgot to last night. > > Ann Marie > organized, thats for certain> > > ---------- > You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. > To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to > LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text > "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". > ---------- > ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 13:46:07 -0400 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: John Cowan Subject: Re: Timing In-Reply-To: <1583828ED67FD211A31D006008277B19236DF6@mail.gammametrics.com> from "Olson, Ann Marie" at Jun 8, 99 10:09:04 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ann Marie Olson wrote: > I -did- state N. America ... just what is the time differential between > California and Melbourne? They locked us out of the clock in 'NT here at > work so I can't just look it up easily, and I forgot to last night. At present California is seven hours behind UTC, and Melbourne is ten hours ahead of UTC. (UTC=Coordinated Universal Time, what used to be called Greenwich Mean Time.) You can think of it as seven hours earlier -- but on the next day. BTW, there are over 400 sets of time zone rules in effect at present; some are the same, but have been different at some point since 1970. For example, U.S. and Canadian time zones currently match, but they had different Daylight Savings (summer time) rules in 1973, when the U.S. went on year-round DST but Canada did not. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org e'osai ko sarji la lojban. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 10:29:57 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Olson, Ann Marie" Subject: Re: Timing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hello, > > I -did- state N. America ... just what is the time differential between > > California and Melbourne? They locked us out of the clock in 'NT here at > > work so I can't just look it up easily, and I forgot to last night. > > At present California is seven hours behind UTC, and Melbourne is > ten hours ahead of UTC. (UTC=Coordinated Universal Time, what used to > be called Greenwich Mean Time.) > > You can think of it as seven hours earlier -- but on the next day. [AMO] Ok, my head hurts ... I'm just a little Nuke Eng here. (temporal mechanics of that sort of variety have always struck me as being too strange for words) > when the > U.S. went on year-round DST but Canada did not. [AMO] Umm... we don't have year-round DST here in California. :) Ann Marie ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 13:58:39 -0400 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: John Cowan Subject: Re: Timing In-Reply-To: <1583828ED67FD211A31D006008277B19236DF8@mail.gammametrics.com> from "Olson, Ann Marie" at Jun 8, 99 10:29:57 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ann Marie Olson writes: > > when the > > U.S. went on year-round DST but Canada did not. > [AMO] > Umm... we don't have year-round DST here in California. :) In the winter of 1972-73 you did, along with the rest of the country. So at that point Los Angeles time was an hour ahead of Vancouver time, although they are exactly the same at present. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org e'osai ko sarji la lojban. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 12:55:29 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Leigh Kimmel Subject: Re: A curious question. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >This would not account for the psychological aspect of meat-rejection found >among Simes, but a cultural truth that "meat is an unwholesome food", >reinforced by painful stomach cramps among out-T refugees who try it during >the flexibility of First Year, and you could have Simes getting instantly >sick at the thought of eating meat. In-T Gens would share this reaction, >even though they are perfectly capable of digesting meat. > I've always suspected that the psychological revulsion for eating meat is related to guilt about the kill -- slaughtering an organism that can look at you and cry out in pain is just too similar to killing at a gut level. (Plants don't have eyes or voices, and therefore there's not the sense of guilt associated with yanking a carrot from the ground or lopping off a head of lettuce). And I suspect that it's so deep that they don't even recognize the connection, and would probably deny it and become very upset if someone pointed it out (and start putting down the pointer-out if that person was perceived as being of lower social status). -- One terrified boy and the girl who would save him. "Claws of Vengeance" on sale now Alexandria Digital Literature http://www.alexlit.com/ Leigh Kimmel -- writer, artist and historian kimmel@globaleyes.net http://members.tripod.com/~kimmel/lhkwebpage.html Ask me how to order the new Sime~Gen novel!!! Visit my bookstore at http://members.tripod.com/~kimmel/bookstore/ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 10:44:25 -0700 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Olson, Ann Marie" Subject: Re: Timing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hello, > In the winter of