========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 07:04:00 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Organization: Murray State University Subject: Re: DIVX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John Cowan wrote: > > Leigh Kimmel scripsit: > > > And Linux and other UNIX variants have too little publicity and too much of > > a reputation as being for "technoweenies and nerds" for it to make any > > progress in the general market. Smart women know that male "technoweenies and nerds" make the best husbands. They're smart, they're not hung up on macho chest-thumping, they make good incomes, they love kids and have endless techie stuff to entertain them, they know how to do household repairs and usually love doing them, most of them can cook, and when you want them out from under foot you just ask them to tweak something on your computer. And best of all, in all areas of life, they are eager to learn new techniques and endlessly inventive. Think about it. > Just you wait, Enry Iggins. M$ may own the desktop for a while yet, > but within 2 years they will not be a serious contender in the server > market. You'll see. > > *mwuhahahahaha* Two years? No way--they have far too large an installation base, world wide, to lose significantly in that length of time. But I do agree, John--it is SO obvious that there has to be a platform that is easier to use at the installation, upgrading, and tweaking level than Windows and at the same time more robust, that the first platform that has _both_ those characteristics, complete compatibility with Windows (people don't want to replace the programs they are familiar with), AND the all-important marketing power behind it, will indeed replace Windows at the rate that users replace their computers. BTW to all, I have temporarily set Simegen-L to "mail" at this e-dress because msumusik crashed at about 10:00am yesterday, and so far the techs have not gotten it up and running again. If they don't get it running today, it will be Monday before they attempt again. If you sent me any personal messages after about 10:00am U.S. CST yesterday, they are trapped somewhere off campus and will not be delivered until msumusik is running again. Jean -- When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl. If no response in 72 hours, try Jean1@Juno.com. Visit my website: http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 14:12:07 GMT Reply-To: gossamer@tertius.net.au Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Gossamer Organization: Computing RJ Subject: WORK: Bibliography questions Finally, bek sits down and writes a bio! Yay! Questions: - Does the first bit read OK? - How do I properly cite things like the Open Letter that've been published in multiple places? - Is it OK to include stuff I wasn't paid for, which is most of the entries here? Is it gratuitous to put in my homepage? There really -is- a lot of my writing there! Anyway, first draft: === Bek Oberin is a 24 year old computer geek living in Melbourne, Australia. After six years she would rather have spent doing other things, she finally completed a computer science/linguistics degree in November 1998. Having coped with Fibromyalgia for the past four years, Bek manages to live on her own with what she terms 'a little help from her friends' and is planning on getting better as soon as possible. Bek writes mostly non-fiction in between programming computers, mucking around on the internet, gardening, spending time with friends and trying to earn a little money. Much of her writing is published on her Internet homepage at http://www.tertius.net.au/~gossamer/. "Changing Times" Grass Roots Magazine Number 129, Oct/Nov 1998 Edition "An Open Letter To People without CFIDS/FMS" The Fibromyalgia Advocate Devin J Starlanyl, MD New Harbinger Publications, Inc. 1998. Brighton and Hove ME Group Newsletter Summer 1998 Edition. Emerge Journal of the ME/CFS Society of Victoria Spring 1998 Edition. Meeting Place Journal of the ANZME Societies Inc Issue 52, Spring 1997 "Research on the Internet" Dialague Student News from Open Learning Australia Issue 15, October 97 "http://www.beginner's.internet.glossary.com/" The Open Letter Magazine of the Open Learning Students' Association Spring 1997 "University and Studying, How to cope with ME/CFS and Studying" Country Network Journal of the Northern Rivers ME/CFS/FM Support Assnociation, INC. Winter, 1997 issue. === -- : Gossamer - gossamer@tertius.net.au - http://tertius.net.au/~gossamer/ : Department of Virtual Tecton Construction (Smof Boards): : http://www.tertius.net.au/simegen/boards/ : Attitude is everything ... except the boots, the leather pants, : the velvet spandex, the spikes, the whips, the chains, the fur : hankie, the chocolate, the cigar, and a tendency to spit out the : window at passing motorists. -- Manx ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 07:14:09 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Organization: Murray State University Subject: Re: Whining Farris MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chantal Whittington wrote: > > On 16-DEC-1998 17:26:49.5 SIMEGEN-L said to AERDEN > It's been said before that the books portray Farris's as > SI>stotic, strong, non complaining types who push themselves beyound the > SI>limit without whining. That's why it is called FICTION! Farris's > SI>certainly push themselves beyound their limits, but they make sure you > SI>know about it afterwards as well! > > ::giggling uncontrollably:: The mental image of, say, Klyd Farris whining > to Hugh that his feet are hot is just too funny to conceive of. The reason Klyd seems stoic and heroic is that he is seen through Hugh's eyes. POV is extremely significant in how we perceive someone. Because we see Digen, Ercy, and Laneff through their own eyes, we know all the weaknesses they see in themselves, all the dizziness, whatever, they experience. Thus they seem to whine, even if they do not complain aloud to anyone. We get their internal monologues to some degree, but not as much as if they were written in first person--that would make them _really_ appear weak. These are decisions writers make in presenting their characters. Jean -- When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl. If no response in 72 hours, try Jean1@Juno.com. Visit my website: http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 10:07:05 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Netdancer2 Subject: TECH: Offtopic Geeking (Was Re: DIVX) In-Reply-To: <368B7640.3488@murraystate.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 07:04 AM 12/31/98 -0600, you wrote: >John Cowan wrote: >> >> Leigh Kimmel scripsit: >> >> > And Linux and other UNIX variants have too little publicity and too much of >> > a reputation as being for "technoweenies and nerds" for it to make any >> > progress in the general market. > >Smart women know that male "technoweenies and nerds" make the best >husbands. They're smart, they're not hung up on macho chest-thumping, >they make good incomes, they love kids and have endless techie stuff to >entertain them, they know how to do household repairs and usually love >doing them, most of them can cook, and when you want them out from under >foot you just ask them to tweak something on your computer. And best of >all, in all areas of life, they are eager to learn new techniques and >endlessly inventive. Think about it. Oh, too true, Jean. :> This quote cheered MY morning. >> Just you wait, Enry Iggins. M$ may own the desktop for a while yet, >> but within 2 years they will not be a serious contender in the server >> market. You'll see. >> >> *mwuhahahahaha* > >Two years? No way--they have far too large an installation base, world >wide, to lose significantly in that length of time. But I do agree, >John--it is SO obvious that there has to be a platform that is easier to >use at the installation, upgrading, and tweaking level than Windows and >at the same time more robust, that the first platform that has _both_ I just read an article that has me all excited, about Linux-based desktops. Linux is much more stable then Windows, and it seems to be coming out from under that "Only usable by geeks" cloud. Corel just released Wordperfect 8 for Linux, free. (I have it on my hard drive, as soon as I set up my own Linux box and Network I'll have it up and running.) It's exciting in that I am very interested in this sort of thing, and that it looks like it will be challenging Microsoft with easy to use, stable platforms. Ken ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 22:42:08 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Gay channels MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On 25-DEC-1998 21:24:34.0 SIMEGEN-L said to AERDEN SI>Another side note. I've heard that a male baby can get an SI>erection. I don't know if this is true or not or, if true, SI>whether it is a sexual reaction, but I did wonder if Sime SI>and Gen baby boys would do this. Sandra Gray--Hi! Yes, this is true. Chantal ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1998 15:31:23 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On 27-DEC-1998 19:28:41.0 SIMEGEN-L said to AERDEN SI> SI>What's the difference between fan fiction and professional fiction SI>writen in someone else's universe? SI>Isn't fan fiction that writen by fans which ISN'T oked or even SI>necessarily seen by the original creator(s)? SI>I understand JL's wanting to keep control over what happens in her SI>universe - but isn't there room here for non mainstream fiction that SI>she DOESN'T ok? I mean, I'm sure that Gene didn't ok every bit of star SI>trek fiction on the web! Forever Knight is another example. Considering the new copyright laws, I would rather know that I could have my S/G fan fiction okayed by the authors, and it still see print. A lot of these unauthorized fanzine editors could be in for major legal trouble, should the big businesses that hold the copyrights to these shows actually decide to pursue legal action. And, re fan fiction based on books, a lot of the authors are clamping down. McCaffrey definitely is, and Marion Zimmer Bradley has already had to. That last brings me to a question for the JL's--How would you need to handle it if a fan wrote a story that was similar in too many details to a Sime/Gen book you were already writing? I heard that Bradley had to throw away several years' work on a Darkover novel because of a situation like this. Fortunately, the two of you keep in close contact with your fans, so we at least have some idea of when to keep our hands off. Chantal ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 16:58:32 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction Comments: To: zeor@ucs.net MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On 29-DEC-1998 11:55:21.7 zeor said to AERDEN ze>That's why we are willing to take the extra time (and it's a lot of ze>extra time) and effort to look at UNFINISHED drafts, mere outlines, ze>mere ideas for a story, and then fleshed outlines, and rough ze>drafts -- to avoid killing the story SPARKLE by fixing the mistakes ze>long before the "final draft" submission. I am in a writing group called _Children of the Vortex_, and this pre-editing of the story idea is exactly what the editors there do. That way, if there are problems with fitting your current idea into the world make-up, they can be hashed out, negotiated, and discussed with the world creators _before_ an author gets told that his finished story 'won't work.' It is one thing that I really like about those editors, that they do not try to kill the story if it won't fit. They work with you to find ways that _can_ allow you to write what you want to write. Chantal http://members.earthlink.net/~cotvortex/ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 12:11:54 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: John Cowan Subject: Re: DIVX In-Reply-To: <368B7640.3488@murraystate.edu> from "Jean Lorrah" at Dec 31, 98 07:04:00 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jean Lorrah scripsit: > Smart women know that male "technoweenies and nerds" make the best [snippage] So says my wife. :-) > Two years? No way--they have far too large an installation base, world > wide, to lose significantly in that length of time. For *desktop* (and laptop, etc.) machines, yes, their installed base is too large to shift for some time to come. But *servers*, the big iron that supports Web pages and provides filing and printing inside corporate intranets, are another story. M$ doesn't own that yet (Novell and Linux are both strong there) and I predict it never will. > complete compatibility with Windows (people don't > want to replace the programs they are familiar with), Unfortunately, Microsoft's monopolistic tactics makes Windows-compatibility a mug's game. Microsoft wins by making things too complicated to emulate. > AND the > all-important marketing power behind it, This of course is what GatesCo is a genius at. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org e'osai ko sarji la lojban. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 10:42:52 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 03:31 PM 12/28/98 -0500, Chantal wrote: >Considering the new copyright laws, I would rather know that I could have my >S/G fan fiction okayed by the authors, and it still see print. A lot of >these unauthorized fanzine editors could be in for major legal trouble, >should the big businesses that hold the copyrights to these shows actually >decide to pursue legal action. And, re fan fiction based on books, a lot of >the authors are clamping down. McCaffrey definitely is, and Marion Zimmer >Bradley has already had to. Jacqueline and I have been working very hard for many years to cultivate a rapport with our fans and a means for their work in our universes to safely see publication, so that we will never be forced into such a situation. >That last brings me to a question for the JL's--How would you need to handle >it if a fan wrote a story that was similar in too many details to a Sime/Gen >book you were already writing? I heard that Bradley had to throw away >several years' work on a Darkover novel because of a situation like this. Why? All she should have had to do was stop publication of the fan's work, if that. I would be curious to know the exact situation. Are you sure it was not the _fan_ who was forced to throw away all his/her work? If either party had to do so, it should _not_ have been the person holding the copyrights on the universe. This is just another reason that we have always asked fans to let us see what they are planning to write, other than short-short stories or parodies, at the outline stage. I can't imagine a fan actually coming up with the same plot that either or both of us are hatching, but supposing it were to happen, we could try to prevent a problem at its inception rather than after the fan had spent months or years working on a S~G novel. But you know what? If it happened, we probably would _still_ publish the fan work, with a statement about coincidence, synchronicity, the astral plane, and great minds working alike. After all, there was no complaint from Doubleday or Playboy Press over the publication of _Sime Surgeon_ as a fanzine. Yes, it was by Jacqueline, but it is essentially the same plot as UZF, certainly the same characters and basic situation. _That_ is what a trade publisher cares about: will publication of this fanzine take business away from the pro-published book, and will it infringe on the rights the author of the pro-published book has sold to us? Obviously, no. Then no problem. >Fortunately, the two of you keep in close contact with your fans, so we at >least have some idea of when to keep our hands off. Communication solves a multitude of problems, in all areas of life. Jean jean.lorrah@murraystate.edu. When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl. ***Dec. 20-27, 1998 reach me at Jean1@Juno.com*** Visit my website, http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165/ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 12:27:17 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: John Cowan Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction In-Reply-To: <368941B300001512@mail.murraystate.edu> (added by from "Jean Lorrah" at Dec 31, 98 10:42:52 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jean Lorrah scripsit: > Why? All she should have had to do was stop publication of the fan's work, > if that. I would be curious to know the exact situation. Are you sure it > was not the _fan_ who was forced to throw away all his/her work? If either > party had to do so, it should _not_ have been the person holding the > copyrights on the universe. The fan accused MZB of plagiarizing her work, and demanded co-author credit. It was the *publisher* (DAW, I assume) who declined to print MZB's novel, to avoid a painful-if-unfounded lawsuit. The results: 1) there is a Darkover novel extant that none of us will ever see; 2) MZB shut down the Darkover anthologies and cracked down on fanfic generally. This is why movies and TV, where far more money is at stake, return all scripts unopened unless they come from a reputable agent. They need a firm defense against unfounded plagiarism suits. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org e'osai ko sarji la lojban. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 09:10:48 -0800 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Donald Jaramillo Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Re: Copyright Again MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit First off, Trademark and Copyright discussions are more of a WORK: topic than OFFTOPIC:, IMHO.... ----- Original Message ----- From: coyote To: Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 1998 11:28 AM Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Re: Copyright Again >Colleen wrote: > >>What's interesting to me is Jacqueline's statement that "Sime~Gen" is a >>trademark. Trademarks apply to goods and I'm not sure that "Sime~Gen" would >>qualify. But it could easily be a service mark, which is essentially the >same >>as a trademark but applies to services. Acceptable specimens for service >>marks are letterhead, business cards, advertising and items of that nature. > >I gather that names can be trademarked, too. My S.O. liked the character >"Baloo" the bear from Disney's Jungle Book film and wanted to use "Baloo" >as a pen name for himself on one of his Web pages. He sent some e-mail to >Disney; they told him that the name was their registered trademark and he >shouldn't use it. > The trademarking of names always makes me think of the lenghts Lucasfilm has gone to. If you look on the figures, every race and name has a mark associated with it. You can even hear the unsaid trademarking in some of the books. I remember reading the novelization of Empire Strikes Back so many years ago. Every time it mentioned "Wampa Ice Creature," and it always did it by the full name as far as I remember, you could see the (tm) after it. I remember that Lucasfilm also supposedly registered the names Thugee and Nazi in the context of Indiana Jones. About Baloo, though.... Wouldn't the estate of Rudyard Kipling have preeminent rights to the name? Follow your Bliss!! Don ddraig@stattenfield.org don@stattenfield.org galkor_ddraig@geocities.com rathorite@geocities.com ICQ: 10762090 (Work) ICQ: 2869199 (Home) AIM: DonJaramil & Ddraig001 ddraig@stattenfield.org don@stattenfield.org galkor_ddraig@geocities.com rathorite@geocities.com ICQ: 10762090 (Work) ICQ: 2869199 (Home) AIM: DonJaramil & Ddraig001 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 14:55:21 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: coyote Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Re: Copyright Again In-Reply-To: <00e601be34e4$e3050f20$5a6856ce@intarsiacorp.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Don wrote: >About Baloo, though.... Wouldn't the estate of Rudyard Kipling have >preeminent rights to the name? We wondered about that. We figured it was kind of odd for Disney, Inc. to have claimed rights to that name without even a nod to any rights that Kipling's heirs may have had. But we had more important things to do with our time than investigate, so we simply dropped the issue. For his own use, Tom changed the spelling of the name, which, as far as we can see, legally resulted in the creation of a different name altogether; one that Disney doesn't own. Seanara "Magic is afoot; the Goddess is ahead." ~ coyote@idsonline.com ~ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 14:19:38 -0800 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Kaas Baichtal Subject: Volunteer Needed for Awards Shelf MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A volunteer is needed to create, house, and maintain a replacement Awards Shelf site. Duties would include the creation of an HTML document clearly displaying historical Awards information with links to various images of awards certificates. This needn't be anything more than a simple list, unless you want to get fancy. Maintenance of the site is minimal, requiring an update only once per year on average. I will provide the text of the Awards history, and the images of the awards certificates, to the first person who responds privately. --Kaas kaas@baichtal.com http://www.baichtal.com/kaas/ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 14:22:18 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: MSUMusik back up! Comments: To: zeor@ucs.net, cormo@juno.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Yippee! Msumusik just came back on-line, and I downloaded 53 messages. Now I have to sort through, and delete the ones that duplicate ones I received on murraystate.edu since last night. Thank goodness the techs got it reconnected before taking off for the long weekend. Jean Ideas expressed in this post are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 08:30:02 +1100 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jean Lorrah wrote: > This is just another reason that we have always asked fans to let us see > what they are planning to write, other than short-short stories or parodies, > at the outline stage. I can't imagine a fan actually coming up with the > same plot that either or both of us are hatching, but supposing it were to > happen, we could try to prevent a problem at its inception rather than after > the fan had spent months or years working on a S~G novel. > > But you know what? If it happened, we probably would _still_ publish the > fan work, with a statement about coincidence, synchronicity, the astral > plane, and great minds working alike. Actually Jean, it's /sort of/ happened. I went to Jacqueline with an outline where I had a situation which somewhat mirrored Tonyo/Logan. Jacqueline pointed out the similarities to me, at which I blushed (*I* hadn't noticed!), and she basically left it up to me what to do. Me, I've taken that element of the outline (relatively minor) and am chewing over it a bit more. Of course, this happened partly because I've seen the Tonyo/Logan stuff in the list, and on the web pages, and it was subconsciously /there/ as something to draw on. If it wasn't, maybe that element would never have been there in the first place. But for reference: Jacqueline left the decision about that plot element *up to me*. She encouraged me to go ahead with the story, though. Jenn V. -- It's amazing where you can go with a completely false premise Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 16:16:41 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Cheryl Wolverton Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > The fan accused MZB of plagiarizing her work, and demanded > co-author credit. It was the *publisher* (DAW, I assume) > who declined to print MZB's novel, to avoid a painful-if-unfounded > lawsuit. The results: 1) there is a Darkover novel extant that > none of us will ever see; 2) MZB shut down the Darkover anthologies > and cracked down on fanfic generally. Actually, I heard the person wrote a book for anthologies for the Darkover universe, MZB refused it..so the person just changed certain 'words' in it....and sold it herslf to someone else.....as a book. So the universe was all like Darkover but they only substituted different symbols etc[for lack of a better word]. Never did hear the entire story and have to wonder just hwat the REAL story is. I have a hard time believing they owuld not take a MZB book no matter what.... -- Cheryl Wolverton The Best Christmas Ever [out now] A Mother's Love [April 99] For The Love of Zach [Sept 99]* http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1037 *Book One of the Hill Creek, Texas Series ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 08:32:58 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Zoe & Eliza ambrov Halwyn Subject: (Asimov's Robot City)Other Peoples Universes Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Has anyone here seen the Asimov Robot City series? They are little books in a series - each one written by a different fan. Asimov had them published as his series - however each segment also has an individual name and author. One I picked up at random has this dedication... "Special thanks for help in writing this novel are due to ........Isaac Asimov for supporting the Robot City project." Asimov also had published the "Issac Asimov Science Fiction Magazine" which helped young authors the way that "Amazing Stories" helped him when he was a young enthusiastic fan of Science Fiction. It seems to me that the fan fiction published on JL's and Jean's Sime Gen sites on the internet is similar to the Robot City project. We acknowledge their universe and they acknowledge that we are a part of it. We DO have to thank them for their assistance and support, and I'm very sorry if anything I said before seemed to indicate in any way that I wasn't aware of this. I am, and JL and Jean know that I have done whatever I can to help them get SimeGen looking professional so that the books will be republished and the movie made. I do, however, have a tendency to play "devils advocate" and speak out for people who are too shy to do so for themselves. I know that I shouldn't do this without being willing to take the flack for them as well. In most cases I am. However, like everyone, outside influences sometimes sneak in and affect my words. In the past 4 weeks I have had several very bad bits of news and I'm afraid that my writings to this list may have been more emotionally charged then they would have otherwise been. I'm sorry if I upset anyone. I don't, however, regret raising the subject of fan fiction! By the way, my "rehtorical" question about fan fiction verses professional was ment to indicate that many of the people who write the fan fiction are professional writers in one form or another. Eliza ambrov Halwyn Companion to Zoe Farris ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 10:38:36 +1100 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Dancer Subject: Re: DIVX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John Cowan wrote: > > Jean Lorrah scripsit: > > Smart women know that male "technoweenies and nerds" make the best > [snippage] > > So says my wife. :-) > > > Two years? No way--they have far too large an installation base, world > > wide, to lose significantly in that length of time. > > For *desktop* (and laptop, etc.) machines, yes, their installed base > is too large to shift for some time to come. But *servers*, the > big iron that supports Web pages and provides filing and printing > inside corporate intranets, are another story. M$ doesn't own > that yet (Novell and Linux are both strong there) and I predict > it never will. Indeed. Reports are that Microsoft is losing the fight to Linux in the Windows NT market (both servers and desktop boxes). This could be worrisome since Windows 2000 is an NT variant, and the non-NT version of Windows ends with Windows 98. D ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 20:02:16 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Comments: RFC822 error: Incorrect or incomplete address field found and ignored. From: jltraut Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Re: Copyright Again MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ---------- > From: John Cowan > Good point. I hadn't thought of stories-in-a-universe as derivative > works (relative to the original stories) but that's certainly defensible. > > Now will you or somebody pu-leeze back me up on the claim that > you can hold a trademark with respect to goods only if those > goods are actually sold? There are two kinds of trademark applications; one showing a "first date of use" in interstate commerce, for which "specimens" (examples showing how the trademark is used, such as product tags, advertisements, etc.) are included with the application, and something called an "intent to use" meaning you're planning to use the trademark on goods or to represent services, but haven't started actually doing business with it. With the Intent To Use, you have a specific time period during which the trademark application continues to go through its process (which takes about 18 months, btw) -- I forget off hand how long (and I'm not at work where I could look it up) before you have to produce those specimens as proof of use. So you're mostly right; a trademark has to be for goods (or services) either in use or *almost* in use for sale. And that's a *registered* trademark; you do have some rights on a "trademark" that you can prove you've used since whenever even if you haven't actually registered it, although the registration makes your claim FAR stronger in any dispute. Which is why Disney (and Lucasfilms, and Paramount, and any other big company with valuable intellectual property) will trademark names of prominent characters, etc., long before the movie even comes out -- mostly for the media-tie-in market. A character whose name appears merely in a book cannot be trademarked -- a character who appears in a book AND a movie AND comes in various toys and action figures and school lunchboxes and sweatshirts, etc., CAN be, and is, for that very reason. (I work for lawyers who specialize in intellectual property; mostly trademarks - you have to be an engineer, really, to do most patents. The U.S. Patent and Trademark Office has a good website, IIRC, and you can get all the (U.S.) copyright information you could possibly want, including all the forms, from the Library of Congress with a phone call.) --Janet jltraut@erols.com (I have *got* to switch my Sime-Gen sub over... ack!) or, if you really have a burning trademark/copyright question - (offer good ONLY until January 22, 1999 when I change jobs and career paths and become a full time computer game writer/developer): buzz me at work: janet@srgpe.com ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 20:27:37 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 08:30 AM 1/1/99 +1100, Jenn wrote: >Actually Jean, it's /sort of/ happened. I went to Jacqueline with an outline >where I had a situation which somewhat mirrored Tonyo/Logan. >Jacqueline pointed out the similarities to me, at which I blushed (*I* hadn't >noticed!), and she basically left it up to me what to do. Me, I've taken that >element of the outline (relatively minor) and am chewing over it a bit more. > >Of course, this happened partly because I've seen the Tonyo/Logan stuff in the >list, and on the web pages, and it was subconsciously /there/ as something to >draw on. If it wasn't, maybe that element would never have been there in the >first place. > >But for reference: Jacqueline left the decision about that plot element *up to >me*. She encouraged me to go ahead with the story, though. As she should. I wouldn't mind at all if you used Zhag and Tonyo as minor characters--had your characters attend one of their performances, for example, or mentioned them as having existed if your story is later in the time line. I'd just rather no one else wrote stories _primarily about_ these characters until I can somehow get the stories I have planned for them into some kind of professional publication. BTW, it's Zhag Paget (Sime shiltpron player) and Tonyo Logan (vocalist and nageric performer). Jean Ideas expressed in this post are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 20:27:52 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Re: Copyright Again Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:10 AM 12/31/98 -0800, Don wrote: >The trademarking of names always makes me think of the lenghts Lucasfilm has >gone to. If you look on the figures, every race and name has a mark >associated with it. You can even hear the unsaid trademarking in some of >the books. I remember reading the novelization of Empire Strikes Back so >many years ago. Every time it mentioned "Wampa Ice Creature," and it always >did it by the full name as far as I remember, you could see the (tm) after >it. I remember that Lucasfilm also supposedly registered the names Thugee >and Nazi in the context of Indiana Jones. > >About Baloo, though.... Wouldn't the estate of Rudyard Kipling have >preeminent rights to the name? Seanara adds, >We wondered about that. We figured it was kind of odd for Disney, Inc. to >have claimed rights to that name without even a nod to any rights that >Kipling's heirs may have had. But we had more important things to do with >our time than investigate, so we simply dropped the issue. For his own use, >Tom changed the spelling of the name, which, as far as we can see, legally >resulted in the creation of a different name altogether; one that Disney >doesn't own. The estate may have sold Disney the right to trademark the names as part of the contract. Alternatively, Kipling's work may have passed into public domain before Disney made the first Jungle Book feature back--when? The 50's? 60's? Prior to 1978, copyright could last no longer than 56 years. Thus it's possible that Disney never had to deal with the Kipling estate. Jean Ideas expressed in this post are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 20:28:07 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 06:51 PM 12/30/98 -0500, Leigh wrote: >Unfortunately some people have other ideas about that. I'm getting to the >point of dropping out of one list dedicated to Tolkien's Middle Earth >languages because the acrimonious tenor of the discussion, which seems to >be centering about the understanding of "fair use" in critical discussion >of Tolkien's languages. They are probably talking about the scholarly version of "fair use." In academic papers, it is very straightforward for prose: 300 words total. That can be a single quote, or the total of the words in quotes spread through the paper. If it goes over 300 words, the author of the paper is required to provide written permissions before the paper can be published. Jean Ideas expressed in this post are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 20:28:18 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Year's Turning Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Happy Year's Turning to everyone on Virtual Selyn! May the new year bring everyone a little fun in life. Where Sime and Gen meet, creativity happens. See it happen at our new home on simegen.com! Look how far we have come in two years. And we're only getting started! Thank you to everyone who has participated in any way in the Sime~Gen Experience, including just being there. Special thanks to all those who have leant a hand to the wheel, or a shoulder to cry on. We hope that in the end, we won't disappoint you. Jean Ideas expressed in this post are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 20:27:58 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: channels & keepers & tantra oh my! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:49 PM 12/24/98 -0500, Chantal wrote: >I've been having thoughts as to 'What is selyn?' for a while, myself. One of my Zhag~Tonyo stories was rejected by a major sf magazine specifically because it did not answer that question in scientific terms. > It's >occurring to me that I have _never_ seen an instance of selyn being injected >into someone. See the scene of Zeth's birth in _First Channel_. "Injected" isn't exactly the right word, as no needle is used. But channels do force selyn into people under certain circumstances. > Also, apparently, there must be five contact points for >Transfer to even take place. I figure this last has something to do with >chakras, so I'm not surprised that I don't fully understand why five >contact points are necessary. On the other hand, I have seen references to >'selyn pluming' or 'She's bleeding selyn,' which I presume are more >metaphorical terms than terms meant to indicate something like actual >bleeding. Selyn isn't liquid, like blood, although selyn is found in blood; it is an invisible but zlinnable energy. Uh, how can I put this? It's the energy of life--think heat or magnetism or electricity. You cannot see these things with normal vision, but all can be observed by their effects or with instruments that detect in a different way than our eyes. Simes have organs which perceive selyn. Of course none of these has a direct one-to-one correspondence to selyn, but if you think of a magnetic field, affected by both that which produces it and by outside forces (gravity, other magnets), perhaps it will give you a sort of analogy for selyn. Jean Ideas expressed in this post are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 21:54:32 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Leigh Kimmel Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >At 06:51 PM 12/30/98 -0500, Leigh wrote: > >>Unfortunately some people have other ideas about that. I'm getting to the >>point of dropping out of one list dedicated to Tolkien's Middle Earth >>languages because the acrimonious tenor of the discussion, which seems to >>be centering about the understanding of "fair use" in critical discussion >>of Tolkien's languages. > >They are probably talking about the scholarly version of "fair use." In >academic papers, it is very straightforward for prose: 300 words total. >That can be a single quote, or the total of the words in quotes spread >through the paper. If it goes over 300 words, the author of the paper is >required to provide written permissions before the paper can be published. >Jean > It's so messy because, for the most part, the items that are under discussion are individual words from Tolkien's languages, quoted individually in discussions of the linguistic processes, both out here in the Primary World (how Tolkien developed them in his own mind and writing) and in the Secondary World (how Tolkien imagined them to have been developed by their fictional speakers). Normally it would be absurd to speak of copyright in quoting individual words. But in the case of the words from a fictional language, there is the argument that the writer created the words and attached meanings to them, so therefore a copyright should adhere. "I do believe my crucifixion before the public has about reached its limit." ---- Admiral Husband E. Kimmel Leigh Kimmel -- writer, artist and historian kimmel@globaleyes.net http://members.tripod.com/~kimmel/lhkwebpage.html keeper of the Sime~Gen mailing list, simegen-l@simegen-com Ask me how to order the new S~G novel!!! ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 13:51:51 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Zoe & Eliza ambrov Halwyn Subject: Mags on line Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Talking about Asimovs Science Fiction Magazine - it's on line at http://www.sfsite.com/asimovs/ Eliza ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 00:48:59 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: WORK: Information feed/changing Goals MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On 30-DEC-1998 14:51:33.7 SIMEGEN-L said to AERDEN SI>The problem is that he's in the midst of composing the first 2 SI>chapters of the second book in the series, and we have the "Volume 2 SI>information feed problem." Not everybody who picks up the second book SI>will necessarily have read the first book, ::nods:: I have this problem with all of James White's 'Sector General' books. I love them to pieces, but the way he explains his universe in each book is practically verbatim from one to another, and it drives me crazy. SI>Also, about goal and conflict: Is it OK for the protag to start out SI>with a particular goal, then have her goal change in the course of the SI>novel (as a logical outgrowth of the original goal and conflict, of SI>course)? Oh, yes. It makes perfect sense for such a thing to happen as your main character matures in the story. For example, I had a main character, a doctor, once who was told by his boss to go see a psychologist. The character's goal at the beginning of the story was to cooperate as little as he could possibly get away with. He considered psychologists to be prying people who hid incompetence behind a lot of meaningless jargon. He went to see the psychologist as ordered--and received quite a shock. The psychologist was very good at his profession and touched one of the doctor's raw nerves. He fled the office. When he finally came to his senses, he realized and accepted for the first time that something was very wrong with him, and that maybe he should do something about it. That became his goal. I called the story "The Spirit of the Word" because that was what the doctor had decided to follow, rather than the letter of his word, which was all he'd meant to give at the beginning. Chantal ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 00:49:07 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Writing and Critiques MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On 30-DEC-1998 15:35:18.5 SIMEGEN-L said to AERDEN SI>Anyway, there really wouldn't have SI>been any way to satisfy everybody who wanted changes. So I moved on. Kaas--::nods:: I learned that while participating in GEnie's Fantasy School Forum. When you offer your work for critique to ten different people, you'll get ten different opinions on how it should be handled. After a while, you have to learn which criticisms to listen to and which to say "Thanks, but no thanks." to. Otherwise, you might lose your original vision of the story. You never want to do that, because that is where the seed of your passion for it lies. A story without that seed of passion won't come alive for you or the reader. I've had to wrestle with this in a story I'm working on. It started as a fantasy, then I got an idea for it to be more of an SF thing. But I'm discovering that the SF version contains less of what had me really excited about the story. So now, I'm having to backtrack and re-find what it is that I originally loved about the thing--and decide if that is a valid basis to build a story on. Chantal ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 01:42:11 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Re: Whining Farris MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On 31-DEC-1998 05:01:33.5 SIMEGEN-L said to AERDEN SI>> "Huh. If you think that's hot, try standing in the Benden SI>Hatching >Grounds!" SI> Why do I keep wanting to call Bender Cove, "Benden Weyr?" Seanara!!!--You're a woman after my own heart. (g) Chantal http://www.delphi.com/falkenstone/ Falkenstone Hold Pern Forum http://members.delphi.com/aerden/index.html Aerden's Homepage ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 01:42:23 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII SI>> The results: 1) there is a Darkover novel extant that SI>> none of us will ever see; 2) MZB shut down the Darkover anthologies SI>> and cracked down on fanfic generally. Yeah. And that last really kills me, because I had written a story specifically for a Darkover anthology. This character started talking to me one night, and I wrote the story's entire first draft in a couple of days. Now, if I want to get it published, I will have to somehow remove all the Darkover references and figure out a different way to make the world and the 'laran' work. It is very frustrating. But if I don't do it, I will feel like I'm letting that character down. I am worried that, even with changes, it will sound too much like an obviously re-done Darkover story. Chantal ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 23:34:54 -0800 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jaye Subject: Re: SIMEGEN-L Digest - 29 Dec 1998 to 30 Dec 1998 (#1998-73) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Jacqueline - I do have many of the symtpoms listed in the article - and I did begin using aspartame about 3-5 years BEFORE the major symtpoms developed. I read the article a week ago and have not ingested any aspartame since -- too early to really judge differences - but I'm hopefull that it will make a difference for me. I thought the article was very unscientifically done - anecdotal as you say - but I thought IF it's true it will be easy for me to find out if I go off the stuff and I get better. I'm off it 'til April 1 - my birthday - for sure. After that, I'll evaluate how I feel and decide whether I ever want it in my system again or if I want to stay off it. I'd been aware of a vague "feeling poisoned" for several years but it hadn't occurred to me to try cutting aspartame -- I've tried cutting almost everything else without success. Even if aspartame only clears up 5% of my problems... that would still be 5% I didn't have to deal with any more. >scientific approach by language and syntax, but beats the alarmist >drum by subject matter, innendo, allusion and annecdote. I agree. It's almost a tabloid style, I thought. I'd have flunked if I'd handed in a biology or psych paper written like it. >Have you considered the 86deg F. limit on heating aspartame? (that's >less than body heat). Have you considered how hot POP gets sitting Exactly. >on those open delivery trucks in the sun? It's worth thinking >about even if this article below isn't too reliable. On the other >hand, every word in it might be true. I don't know. IFF anyone's interested, I'll make a note to write a report of my trial off it (yes, I said "off" not "of) at the end of 3 months and post it here. Jayelithe orchestra@wingedharper.com _Anything worth doing is worth doing poorly at first._ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 00:32:28 -0800 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jaye Subject: SG list Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi, Kaas - Yeah, I read some of the comments on your story -- I doubt I'd ever have tried to write another word if I'd received some of them... (tho others were pretty positive.) I sent a story to JL last spring that I've been working on off and on for 8 years -- I KNEW it was flawed but I wasn't sure what was wrong with it - and she was very gentle and positive in her comments but it still took awhile to get past some of the comments, even tho I knew they were mostly exactly the feedback I needed. (Incidentally, while one of her comments really got my goat at the time, gradually I'm beginning to think it may be the very key I need to transform the story into something really usable. One of my characters that my subconscious threw in, I really dind't like and I dropped her partway through - but it looks like boy, she's going to be central in the rework! I sitll don't LIKE her, but she's the perfect antagonist for my protagonist (or vice versa, it may turn out.)) NOT the other character I was focusing on. On Selyn - Jacqueline - did you say at one point in the Aspectarian something about it being 90-degrees from kundalini and chi and being something linked in from the Astral? I did'nt follow that but if you'd talk more about it, maybe I coudl get a better picture of it... Also - I was picturing the sense of selyn "pluming" away as being kinda like how dry ice vaporing would be but to zlinning rather than to sight... is that in any way accurate or is it something totally different? Chantal - Yes, I remember the story - I think it was "The Keeper's Price" -- and I think Hillary did eventually take up with Damon et al. Jayelithe orchestra@wingedharper.com _Anything worth doing is worth doing poorly at first._ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 19:36:13 +1100 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: OFFTOPIC SMOF: Chemicals & Should we make a new... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jaye wrote: > IFF anyone's interested, I'll make a note to write a report of my trial > off it (yes, I said "off" not "of) at the end of 3 months and post it here. As someone who regularly gets poisoned by 'harmless' chemicals, consider me interested. Question for the purposes of gathering information: I'm aware that the list gets busy with some of the offtopic chats we have (totally aside from the 'too-much-information' chats which get moved to the morals-l list). What would people think of the option of making .. say .. an 'chat-l@simegen.com' or similar list? Have /this/ list's charter be Sime~Gen & closely related stuff, and chat-l@simegen.com (or whatever we call it) be for ... well, for the /community/ stuff. I really feel that the community element /makes/ our list special - but since we lost the topic masks I've been watching our unsubscribes closely & listening to people, and I think maybe it would be an idea to split off the community to another list. Or maybe something else should be split... So right now, I want IDEAS! Jenn V. -- It's amazing where you can go with a completely false premise Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 02:57:02 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Cheryl Wolverton Subject: Re: SIMEGEN-L Digest - 29 Dec 1998 to 30 Dec 1998 (#1998-73) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jaye wrote: > Jacqueline - > > I do have many of the symtpoms listed in the article - and I did begin > using aspartame about 3-5 years BEFORE the major symtpoms developed. > I read the article a week ago and have not ingested any aspartame since -- > too early to really judge differences - but I'm hopefull that it will make > a difference for me. > I remember when they were first trying to get this stuff approved...does anyone else remember the uproar about problems and the need for more testing etc etc...and then shortly after it was approved all of these problems started popping up and the media went crazy with 'investigations' and then suddenly boom...nothing....i had to wonder just how much money had been pumped into the media to shut them up etc.... i've always believed the asp. was bad for the health and can tell a significant difference from when i am on it and off it....just fyi...but then...what can i say:) just my two cents -- Cheryl Wolverton The Best Christmas Ever [out now] A Mother's Love [April 99] For The Love of Zach [Sept 99]* http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/1037 *Book One of the Hill Creek, Texas Series ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 09:19:56 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: John Cowan Subject: Re: Submitting Fan Fiction In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19990101022807.0070d25c@msumusik.mursuky.edu> from "Jean Lorrah" at Dec 31, 98 08:28:07 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jean Lorrah scripsit: > They are probably talking about the scholarly version of "fair use." In > academic papers, it is very straightforward for prose: 300 words total. This is *unpublished* material, though, for which is there is no fair use. What they are actually talking about is whether the people whose job it is to publish the stuff are doing their job. At current rates, it will be some 70 *years* before it all appears. -- John Cowan cowan@ccil.org e'osai ko sarji la lojban. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 09:53:38 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Comments: RFC822 error: MESSAGE-ID field duplicated. Last occurrence was retained. From: Cynthia Tenen Subject: Re: Submitting fan fiction Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" John Cowan wrote: >The results: 1) there is a Darkover novel extant that >none of us will ever see; John -- That's what I understand was the case also; it was the publisher who didn't want to risk potential trouble. But I thought the disputed novel was what's now known as "Exile's Song." Was "Exile's Song" re-plotted to cover the same territory as the disputed novel? Cynthia ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 09:35:59 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: SF Survey Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I took the time to fill in the SF survey to help the guy out, and here is the response I got: >Your message > > To: ParkDH@cardiff.ac.uk > Subject: Re: Fw: Re: Research on SF audience > Sent: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 06:44:04 -0600 > >did not reach the following recipient(s): > >ParkDH@cardiff.ac.uk on Fri, 1 Jan 1999 07:36:43 -0600 > The recipient was unavailable to take delivery of the message > MSEXCH:IMS:MSU:COE:COEEXCHANGE 3499 (000B099C) Host unreachable Larry, how OLD was that message you sent on to us? Sometimes these things get passed on for years. I'll bet he has graduated and gone. Jean Ideas expressed in this post are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 11:17:43 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Distect@AOL.COM Subject: Re: SF Survey Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-01 10:37:57 EST, a21711f@MSUMUSIK.MURSUKY.EDU writes: << Larry, how OLD was that message you sent on to us? Sometimes these things get passed on for years. I'll bet he has graduated and gone. Jean >> The message was actually fairly recent - from around Thanksgiving, as I recall. I got the same survey on another screen name which I don't check very often and replied to it about three weeks after I got it, then forgot all about it. A short time later I received a very nice thank you from Mr. Park at the same screen name. Perhaps his server is off line for some reason? Or perhaps he had that e-dress only while he was gathering data and now has what he needs and has canceled it. Colleen M. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 13:29:46 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: MLCVamp@AOL.COM Subject: BACK: Postsyndrome question Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit A possibly silly question occurred to me: Suppose 2 Simes fall in love, and their need cycles are precisely opposite -- one is always at turnover at the same time the other one is ready for transfer. They would never be sexually receptive at the same time. A "tragic" star-crossed love that could easily tip over into farce. Could their cycles be gradually manipulated to come into sync? If so, how? (I suppose this wouldn't be a big problem with a Channel/Companion love affair, since the Gen could just postpone transfer for 2 weeks in order to get into sync with the Sime.) RE Mary Lou's "Doubtful Document": I was surprised at Tallin's conjecture that Eskalie's parents are 14 or 15 years past changeover. That would make Eskalie so much younger than I visualized (though I suppose I should have known better -- if she's in First Year and changed over on a normal RenSime schedule, she couldn't be much over 14 or 15). Good grief, all these Sime "adults" I've been reading about are, many of them, just TEENAGERS -- younger than our "baby," who, at age 16, doesn't drive or date yet. Eskalie is out there earning a living and undertaking dangerous independent assignments at an age when our kids are still almost completely sheltered. It's quite a culture shock for me, though it wouldn't have been if I'd thought it through. (When Simes enter Gen Territory to establish Centers and give changeover training, etc., they often mention the discrepancies between Sime and Gen standards of "adulthood." I shoulda been more aware.) Are all or most Gens aware (esp. before Unity) that when a girl starts her period or a boy grows facial hair, they are "safe" from "turning Sime"? LL&P, Margaret Carter ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 05:10:18 +1000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Zoe & Eliza ambrov Halwyn Subject: Re: BACK: Postsyndrome question Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 13:29 1/01/99 EST, MLCVamp@AOL.COM wrote: >Could their cycles be gradually manipulated to come into sync? If so, how? Rensimes supposedly (under the tecton this is, not before) have transfer early so that they don't ever really feel "need". It shouldn't be a problem then, to get permission to have transfer a little earlier each month until they are in sync. (sort of like going to the priest to get permission to marry really isn't it?) Pre Tecton it wouldn't have been a problem - they would have just had transfer early. Good grief, all these Sime >"adults" I've been reading about are, many of them, just TEENAGERS YES! Isn't it a shock to the system when you realise that! Not only that, but pre unity, the pens, they were breeding and killing children! If you remember one book (First Channel) Rimons Father was talking about not breeding the stock for at least one year after establishment - this means that they are possible breeding children as young as 12 onwards - and killing even younger ones! Fortunately I hadn't realised that until I was already hooked by the series. Eliza ambrov Halwyn Companion to Zoe Farris ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 14:25:07 -0600 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Jean Lorrah Subject: Re: BACK: Postsyndrome question Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:29 PM 1/1/99 EST, Margaret wrote: >A possibly silly question occurred to me: Suppose 2 Simes fall in love, and >their need cycles are precisely opposite -- one is always at turnover at the >same time the other one is ready for transfer. They would never be sexually >receptive at the same time. A "tragic" star-crossed love that could easily >tip over into farce. > >Could their cycles be gradually manipulated to come into sync? If so, how? >(I suppose this wouldn't be a big problem with a Channel/Companion love >affair, since the Gen could just postpone transfer for 2 weeks in order to get >into sync with the Sime.) What happens is that each month one of the pair tries to go at least a few hours longer, while the other takes transfer a day early. In a few months, they meet in the middle. >RE Mary Lou's "Doubtful Document": I was surprised at Tallin's conjecture >that Eskalie's parents are 14 or 15 years past changeover. That would make >Eskalie so much younger than I visualized (though I suppose I should have >known better -- if she's in First Year and changed over on a normal RenSime >schedule, she couldn't be much over 14 or 15). Good grief, all these Sime >"adults" I've been reading about are, many of them, just TEENAGERS -- younger >than our "baby," who, at age 16, doesn't drive or date yet. Eskalie is out >there earning a living and undertaking dangerous independent assignments at an >age when our kids are still almost completely sheltered. It's quite a culture >shock for me, though it wouldn't have been if I'd thought it through. (When >Simes enter Gen Territory to establish Centers and give changeover training, >etc., they often mention the discrepancies between Sime and Gen standards of >"adulthood." I shoulda been more aware.) Humanity has been thrown back to subsistence levels, particularly in Sime Territories, where the average life span is even _less_ than the thirty-year average that humans drop to when they lose all their technology. Why do you think initiations into adulthood take place around age 12-14? Because in survival-level societies, that is the half-way point of an average life span, and people are expected to take over adult jobs, marry, and reproduce. Henry V was fourteen when he led the army that defeated Hotspur at Shrewsbury. Lafayette was sixteen when he came to America to fight as a general in the colonial army. My grandmother married at sixteen, immediately opened her own business, had her first child at seventeen. My mother left school after eighth grade to help support the family by working in a silk mill. That's not ancient history--it happened in the 20th century. Don't judge the people in S~G by the number of years they have lived; judge them by the percentage of their lifespans they have lived. After Unity, nonjunct and even disjunct Simes suddenly find themselves living to fifty natal years or more--and don't know what to do with the extra years they never planned for! >Are all or most Gens aware (esp. before Unity) that when a girl starts her >period or a boy grows facial hair, they are "safe" from "turning Sime"? Yes, they would use those as markers, which means that many boys would be safe for years before they were certain. Jean Ideas expressed in this post are my opinion unless otherwise attributed. Jean Lorrah A21711F@msumusik.mursuky.edu. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3439 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/4165 ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 15:42:25 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Karen Litman Subject: Re: internet access Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I received this from another list I am on. It might be worth checking out. Karen Litman << > < CNN stated that the Government would in two weeks time decide to > allow or not allow a Charge to your phone bill equal to a long distance > call each time you access the internet. > The address is http://www.house.gov/writerep/ > > Please visit the address above and fill out the necessary form! If EACH > one of us, forward this message on to others in a hurry, we may be able > to prevent this injustice from happening!>> >> ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 16:22:21 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: coyote Subject: Re: internet access In-Reply-To: <9a85fa7d.368d3331@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Karen wrote: >I received this from another list I am on. It might be worth checking out. > > < CNN stated that the Government would in two weeks time decide to > > allow or not allow a Charge to your phone bill equal to a long distance > > call each time you access the internet. > > The address is http://www.house.gov/writerep/ Karen, If I remember correctly, this was an exaggeration (I won't go so far as to say "hoax") that was going around the Net some months ago. There *was* some kind of an issue about somebody wanting to charge the major ISPs extra for their long distance connections, but not the individual phone user. Anybody have any more info. on this? Seanara "Magic is afoot; the Goddess is ahead." ~ coyote@idsonline.com ~ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 14:10:07 -0800 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Tony Zbaraschuk Subject: Re: BACK: Postsyndrome question In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19990101202507.00714a6c@msumusik.mursuky.edu> from "Jean Lorrah" at Jan 1, 99 02:25:07 pm Content-Type: text Jean Lorrah wrote: > Humanity has been thrown back to subsistence levels, particularly in Sime > Territories, where the average life span is even _less_ than the thirty-year > average that humans drop to when they lose all their technology. Why do you > think initiations into adulthood take place around age 12-14? Because in > survival-level societies, that is the half-way point of an average life > span, and people are expected to take over adult jobs, marry, and reproduce. Ummm... this is a very common statistical error, actually (at least when looking from modern societies at ancient ones; perhaps things really are different among junct Simes). It arises from confusing a normal distribution with a bimodal distribution. An "average lifespan" of 30 years didn't mean that most people died around 25-35; it meant that about half the population died before age 5 and the other half mostly died in the 50-70 bracket. (And sometimes much older -- Ramesses II, admittedly with good nutrition since he was on top of the social structure, lived into his 90s.) Having women die in childbirth pulls the average down again, but doesn't much affect the maximum age of men, or of women who reach menopause. The average lifespan at birth, and the lifespan you can achieve if you die of old age rather than war, pestilence, famine, or childbirth, are quite different things. And it's the latter lifespan that governs social structures, more often than not. > Henry V was fourteen when he led the army that defeated Hotspur at > Shrewsbury. Well, actually, his father led it, though I agree that HENRY IV is a great play. > Lafayette was sixteen when he came to America to fight as a > general in the colonial army. Which position he got because he charmed Congress into it and because of his standing as a member of the French nobility; it royally ticked off quite a number of American generals who were considerably older. The (forty-plus) Washington used Layfayette essentially as an aide until he was sure that the Marquis could handle things. > My grandmother married at sixteen, > immediately opened her own business, had her first child at seventeen. My > mother left school after eighth grade to help support the family by working > in a silk mill. That's not ancient history--it happened in the 20th century. I'm not claiming that the age of maturity wasn't somewhat earlier -- modern society tends to lengthen adolescence considerably -- but to start somewhat earlier doesn't necessarily entail a massive decrease in lifespan, either. > Don't judge the people in S~G by the number of years they have lived; judge > them by the percentage of their lifespans they have lived. > > After Unity, nonjunct and even disjunct Simes suddenly find themselves > living to fifty natal years or more--and don't know what to do with the > extra years they never planned for! Junct Simes I'll believe; we've had considerable evidence that the junct lifespan is inherently unhealthy (primarily due to most Simes not having a clue about nutrition, and partly to the inherently high violence associated with being junct). But it probably wouldn't be very hard to track down junct Simes who were fifty-plus years old, maybe 35-40 years past changeover, and it's _those_ people who pass experience to the next generation. I find it hard to see how some of the available bodies of knowledge (like the set of specialized skills a Genfarmer needs) were accumulated otherwise. In the interest of the correct interpretation of statistics, Tony Z ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 17:48:06 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Karen Litman Subject: Computer Request Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit If anyone can find a good desktop computer for internet access and IRC, our new fan Eric Berlin would greatfully accept it. He lives in Southern New Jersey near me. Eric has earned his Sime~Gen stripes by helping me replace the monitor for my computer last week. Eric is legally blind, so this is why we need a desktop system. A good 386 or 486 would probably fit the bill. Many thanks. Karen Litman ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 19:15:27 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Aspartame Article MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On 1-JAN-1999 02:37:07.3 SIMEGEN-L said to AERDEN SI>Jacqueline - SI>I do have many of the symtpoms listed in the article - and I did begin SI>using aspartame about 3-5 years BEFORE the major symtpoms developed. SI>I read the article a week ago and have not ingested any aspartame since SI>-- SI>too early to really judge differences - but I'm hopefull that it will SI>make a difference for me. SI>I thought the article was very unscientifically done - anecdotal as you SI>say - but I thought IF it's true it will be easy for me to find out if SI>I go off the stuff and I get better. Jayelithe, Jacqueline--My mother is diabetic and went blind in 1977. She's a lifelong drinker of Tab and now, Diet Coke, so I was very concerned about her. I haven't noticed any MS symptoms, but when I forwarded the letter to my Dad, he said that _he_ had been having symptoms like those described in the article. He drinks Diet Coke. He works at NASA-JSC and has forwarded the letter to the Safety Director in hopes that that person will be able to research the article and/or make some judgment as to its validity. I've asked him to keep me posted. I drink The Real Thing, but I do use Equal in iced tea and in coffee if I have no sugar or other sweetener handy. I'll be interested to see whether this article has any solid fact behind it, and what the facts are. Chantal ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 19:16:06 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Re: SF Survey MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII On 1-JAN-1999 11:20:22.2 SIMEGEN-L said to AERDEN SI>In a message dated 99-01-01 10:37:57 EST, a21711f@MSUMUSIK.MURSUKY.EDU SI>writes: SI><< Larry, how OLD was that message you sent on to us? Sometimes these SI>things get passed on for years. I'll bet he has graduated and gone. SI>Jean >> Jean--He's still here. I just got a thank-you reply from him. Try sending your response again. Chantal ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 00:24:38 GMT Reply-To: gossamer@tertius.net.au Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Gossamer Organization: Computing RJ Subject: Re: DIVX Jean Lorrah (jean.lorrah@MURRAYSTATE.EDU) wrote... > Smart women know that male "technoweenies and nerds" make the best > husbands. They're smart, they're not hung up on macho chest-thumping, > they make good incomes, they love kids and have endless techie stuff to > entertain them, they know how to do household repairs and usually love > doing them, most of them can cook, and when you want them out from under > foot you just ask them to tweak something on your computer. And best of > all, in all areas of life, they are eager to learn new techniques and > endlessly inventive. Ohh, may I put this in the quote file.? Pretty please? bekj -- : Gossamer - gossamer@tertius.net.au - http://tertius.net.au/~gossamer/ : Department of Virtual Tecton Construction (Smof Boards): : http://www.tertius.net.au/simegen/boards/ : Thunderstorms are violent. Earthquakes are violent. Ocean waves : can be violent. Forging metal is violent. Violence in and of : itself is not a bad thing. Nor is it a good thing. It merely : *is*. -- Wolfie Green ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 18:18:33 -0800 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Kaas Baichtal Subject: Re: Awards Shelf Volunteer Found MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It appears that my original letter was inadequate in explaining my motive for giving up the Awards Shelf site. Rather than chase down the various rumors of who has asked, I will post a public explanation here. I had been unsatisfied with the page for some time and felt it required a major restructuring and facelift. Recently I have had cause to re-examine my commitment to each of the Sime~Gen websites I have been involved with, and I realized that I am no longer able to either identify with the Awards Shelf's purpose or justify the effort that would be required for its overhaul. Therefore, I concluded, it is time for somebody else to take it over. Eliza Leahy sent the sole reply to my call for a replacement. I will be sending her the Awards shelf data and a new site will presumably be up shortly. Any future information on awards should be forwarded to her. --Kaas kaas@baichtal.com http://www.baichtal.com ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 19:59:16 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: coyote Subject: Re: Techie mates (was DVIX) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Jean Lorrah (jean.lorrah@MURRAYSTATE.EDU) wrote... >Smart women know that male "technoweenies and nerds" make the best >husbands. They're smart, they're not hung up on macho chest-thumping, >they make good incomes, they love kids and have endless techie stuff to >entertain them, they know how to do household repairs and usually love >doing them, most of them can cook, and when you want them out from under >foot you just ask them to tweak something on your computer. And best of >all, in all areas of life, they are eager to learn new techniques and >endlessly inventive. Jean, you said it! I'm lucky enough to have one of those pet techies (we've been S.O.'s for several years), and I don't know where I'd be without him. Probably using an electric typewriter and seeing rewrites as a major torture, and running up phone bills big time whenever I wanted to talk to anyone. If it weren't for Tom, I probably wouldn't be computer literate -- he chose a system for me, put it together, set up and installed everything, and taught me how to use it. When something screws up in my system, he either fixes it for me or talks me through how to fix it myself. I've found geeks to be loyal; they don't chase other women, they do treat you with respect and, as you said, they're intelligent and helpful. Mine rarely cooks, but he does know how, and he doesn't mind eating at restaurants often, especially if I don't feel like cooking. But, for anyone who's thinking of acquiring a pet geek, be aware: they tend to be introverted and don't operate much on an emotional level (they're creatures of logic); they don't like shopping, they forget birthdays and other special occasions, they tend to be messy, and they require heavy doses of caffeine first thing in the morning to get them going. They also like homemade meals, 'cause they're used to grabbing what they can at Mickey D's and running back to the computer. Make sure you bake them some chocolate chip cookies now and then. That's a geek favorite. Seanara "Magic is afoot; the Goddess is ahead." ~ coyote@idsonline.com ~ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 20:18:31 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Annpiccolo@AOL.COM Subject: Re: OFFTOPIC SMOF: Chemicals & Should we make a new... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-01 03:47:42 EST, you write: << I really feel that the community element /makes/ our list special - but since we lost the topic masks I've been watching our unsubscribes closely & listening to people, and I think maybe it would be an idea to split off the community to another list. Or maybe something else should be split... >> I wouldn't mind seeing the computer technical stuff split off. Very little of it makes any sense to me anyway. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 20:32:15 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Annpiccolo@AOL.COM Subject: Re: BACK: Postsyndrome question Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-01 13:31:06 EST, you write: << Could their cycles be gradually manipulated to come into sync? If so, how? (I suppose this wouldn't be a big problem with a Channel/Companion love affair, since the Gen could just postpone transfer for 2 weeks in order to get into sync with the Sime.) >> I bet that the only real problem would be Tecton scheduling. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 20:42:53 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Annpiccolo@AOL.COM Subject: Re: BACK: Postsyndrome question Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-01 13:31:06 EST, you write: << Good grief, all these Sime "adults" I've been reading about are, many of them, just TEENAGERS -- younger than our "baby," who, at age 16, doesn't drive or date yet. >> Zeth and Owen aren't even teenagers yet when they take on enormous adult responsibility for their whole community. I can never quite believe how young Owen is when he more or less becomes the Fort Freedom minister, but Ancients don't go through First Year as Simes and to some extent Gens do. Our process of maturing is inately different as well as culturally different. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 12:39:43 +1100 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Re: Techie mates (was DVIX) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit coyote wrote: > > >Jean Lorrah (jean.lorrah@MURRAYSTATE.EDU) wrote... > > >Smart women know that male "technoweenies and nerds" make the best > >husbands. > But, for anyone who's thinking of acquiring a pet geek, be aware: they tend > to be introverted and don't operate much on an emotional level (they're > creatures of logic); they don't like shopping, they forget birthdays and > other special occasions, they tend to be messy, and they require heavy > doses of caffeine first thing in the morning to get them going. They also > like homemade meals, 'cause they're used to grabbing what they can at > Mickey D's and running back to the computer. Make sure you bake them some > chocolate chip cookies now and then. That's a geek favorite. Now imagine a household of TWO technoweenies! We've been married .. um, we usually have to check the wedding certificate to be sure whether we were married in 1990 or 1991 .. and I won't try to calculate how many times we've forgotten our wedding anniversary. ... and that's not easy because it's right next to my mother's birthday, which is around Mother's Day ... Food: we cook large batches of microwave-reheatable meals which are as complete nutritionally as possible (stews, casseroles, soups). A constant diet of takeaway hampers the brain cells. :) Shopping: food shopping we tend to do together, because we swap off on who prepares the stew-like-thing. :) Shopping for major items, we do background research (usually over the net) to figure out what the average price of the desired item (with the desired features) is, then we go ahead and pick one up when we see one at a fair price. We limit the amount of hunting-for-bargains on a rule-of-thumb scale - our /time/ is worth $X, so if we spend Y amount of time looking for it, it'd better drop the price by at least $X * Y hours.... Mess: Saturday afternoons is clean-up day. Sundays we have friends over. :) Two grown kids picking up their room... Jenn V. -- It's amazing where you can go with a completely false premise Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 18:00:11 -0800 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Tony Zbaraschuk Subject: Re: Techie mates (was DVIX) In-Reply-To: <199901020039.TAA11481@ids2.idsonline.com> from "coyote" at Jan 1, 99 07:59:16 pm Content-Type: text Jean wrote: > >Smart women know that male "technoweenies and nerds" make the best > >husbands. They're smart, they're not hung up on macho chest-thumping, > >they make good incomes, they love kids and have endless techie stuff to > >entertain them, they know how to do household repairs and usually love > >doing them, most of them can cook, and when you want them out from under > >foot you just ask them to tweak something on your computer. And best of > >all, in all areas of life, they are eager to learn new techniques and > >endlessly inventive. Hmm... now, where do I find one of these women? Seanara wrote: > But, for anyone who's thinking of acquiring a pet geek, be aware: they tend > to be introverted and don't operate much on an emotional level (they're > creatures of logic); they don't like shopping, they forget birthdays and > other special occasions, they tend to be messy, and they require heavy > doses of caffeine first thing in the morning to get them going. They also > like homemade meals, 'cause they're used to grabbing what they can at > Mickey D's and running back to the computer. Make sure you bake them some > chocolate chip cookies now and then. That's a geek favorite. The description is correct, though caffeine isn't mandatory. Tony Z ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 12:52:51 +1100 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Re: Techie mates (was DVIX) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tony Zbaraschuk wrote: > > The description is correct, though caffeine isn't mandatory. > I got thrown cold-turkey off caffeine while in the States. I don't like coffee, and I discovered that I couldn't stand either US coke or US pepsi. So I'm staying off it. Irritability I don't need.. Jenn V. -- It's amazing where you can go with a completely false premise Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 21:07:15 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Annpiccolo@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Aspartame Article Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-01 19:17:01 EST, you write: << I drink The Real Thing, but I do use Equal in iced tea and in coffee if I have no sugar or other sweetener handy. I'll be interested to see whether this article has any solid fact behind it, and what the facts are. >> What I don't think either the artificial sweetener makers or the suger producers of the world would like anyone to know is that you can with a little work actually change your taste preferences. Some years ago I needed to cut down on sugar and quit putting it in my tea. For a few days my tea tasted funny and then my taste shifted so that tea without suger tasted just as normal as tea with sugar ever did. I have also switched to unsweetened yogurt and cranberry juice and seek out whenever possible other foods that do not have sugar added. I have developed a preference for them too. Now ordinary cranberry juice cocktails taste like sugar water to me and I don't even like the smell of tea with sugar. Now the biggest problem I have is finding drinks without sugar added. I would like to hear about anything anyone knows about. Usually if I go into a deli for lunch, for instance, just about the only bottled substances I can find without added sugar or artificial sweeteners are water and orange juice. For a while Lipton put out an unsweetened ice tea, but I haven't seen it around lately. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 22:43:41 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: coyote Subject: Unsweetened drinks (re Aspartame) In-Reply-To: <89827cd.368d7f53@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Now the biggest problem I have is finding drinks >without sugar added. I would like to hear about anything anyone knows about. I don't care much for sweet drinks, either. When I'm not in the mood for hot stuff like coffee or herbal tea, I drink flavored seltzer. They have it in supermarkets and in most delis. But be careful to pick just the plain, flavored, unsweetened seltzer (raspberry, lemon-line, and mandarin orange are the usual kinds). There are some seltzer *drinks" out there that have corn syrup or other sweeteners in them; those aren't what you want. Seanara "Magic is afoot; the Goddess is ahead." ~ coyote@idsonline.com ~ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 01:03:05 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Chantal Whittington Subject: Unsweetened drinks (re Aspartame) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII I've discovered that I can drink echinacea tea quite happily, plain. Plain Earl Grey, on the other hand--bleah! And black coffee--double bleah! I do like unsweetened cranberry juice and grapefruit juice. As for regular tea...You're talking to someone who discovered Georgia Sweet Tea and decided it was good stuff. I wish they sold it in Texas. ::sigh:: Pepsi, on the other hand, is too sweet, and so are all diet drinks, to me. New Coke was awful stuff, and I can't abide Mountain Dew, it's so sweet. Milk, I like plain, but chocolate ain't bad...(g) Chantal ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 08:00:36 +0000 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Sheila Clark Subject: Re: Aspartame Article In-Reply-To: <89827cd.368d7f53@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain On 02 Jan, wrote: > Now the biggest problem I have is finding drinks without sugar added. In my innocence when I first saw drinks with 'no added sugar' I thought it meant 'no added sweetening'. One mouthful was enough to tell me that no, I did -not- want to drink 'no added sugar' liquids. However, it's becoming -very- difficult now to find soft drinks that don't have artificial sweetering, mostly aspartame. Even without reading about problems associated, I don't use it. I don't like the taste. I can see me being reduced to ordinary water... if only -that- still tasted like water, and didn't have added chlorine, fluoride... sometimes you can smell the chemicals as the stuff comes out of the tap. It's also becoming difficult here to get proper cheese. It's almost all 'Genetically modified so no animal rennet is used'. That uses two words describing something that I am avoiding - I am far from convinced it's safe. Sheila -- Sheila Clark Email sheilac@argonet.co.uk Imagination is much more important than knowledge ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 11:17:36 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Karen Litman Subject: Re: Aspartame Article Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sheila wrote I can see me being reduced to ordinary water... if only -that- still tasted like water, and didn't have added chlorine, fluoride... sometimes you can smell the chemicals as the stuff comes out of the tap. For the moment I still have my new well, which meets all kinds of Federal Government standards for pure water. However, the State of New Jersey, USA in their infinite stupidity has made it a law that if "city" water (chemical laden as above) is available in your area, you _must_ connect to it, and either cap your well, or convert it to agricultural use. I was _supposed_ to have my connections made to the city system by the end of December, but due to lack of money available for such things, we didn't do it. Now I'm waiting to see what "the powers that be" will do to us to force compliance. Drinking "city" water --- I can sure tell when I am, and I can't stand it. ----- Karen Litman ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 11:24:02 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: PMNewcomb@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Jacqueline Agrees! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 98-12-28 16:41:31 EST, you write: << Okay, folks--Jacqueline agrees with me that we should have an "authorized unauthorized" site for sime~Gen fiction that, for whatever reason, the authors do not want to run past Jacqueline and me. Any volunteers to run such a site? We will give you a website for it on simegen.com if you don't have a place of your own. Jean >> I've followed with interest the recent discussion about unauthorized or "impossible" stories, because I have a few in the old file cabinet. I wrote them long before I was aware of the fandom's tradition, and won't go back to third and fourth draft them because of the time factor.... so much has changed in me and my writing, it's not really possible to rework them. Any tiny increment of time I eke out of my impossible schedule, I want to put to the new stuff! Unfortunately, I can't volunteer to run the website, having no skills nor time to learn them (am reading 3 weeks of email tonight, and teeter on the "sign off the list" decision each time I return because of the volume of messages... but tonight I'm glad I didn't), but I perhaps can work up the courage to submit stuff to such a site... I just really want to applaud you JLs too ... at every turn you debate, consider, decide .. in a manner everyone should aspire to.... Well, anyway, here's hoping all corners of this world do well, the movie comes to fruition, the new books get published in all formats, the lists live on, and the Chat is lively! PMN : ) ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 12:11:50 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Annpiccolo@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Unsweetened drinks (re Aspartame) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-02 01:11:22 EST, you write: << You're talking to someone who discovered Georgia Sweet Tea and decided it was good stuff. I wish they sold it in Texas. >> I'll browse around the net and see if I can find us a mail order source. I get lots of teas that way. Thanks. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 12:13:40 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Annpiccolo@AOL.COM Subject: Re: .Unsweetened drinks (re Aspartame) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-01 22:38:12 EST, you write: << I drink flavored seltzer. They have it in supermarkets and in most delis. But be careful to pick just the plain, flavored, unsweetened seltzer (raspberry, lemon-line, and mandarin orange are the usual kinds). There are some seltzer *drinks" out there that have corn syrup or other sweeteners in them; those aren't what you want. >> Yes, you really have to check the ingredient list on the bottles very carefully. Thanks. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 12:22:21 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Annpiccolo@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Aspartame Article Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-02 11:19:15 EST, you write: << Sheila wrote I can see me being reduced to ordinary water... if only -that- still tasted like water, and didn't have added chlorine, fluoride... sometimes you can smell the chemicals as the stuff comes out of the tap. For the moment I still have my new well, which meets all kinds of Federal Government standards for pure water. However, the State of New Jersey, USA in their infinite stupidity has made it a law that if "city" water (chemical laden as above) is available in your area, you _must_ connect to it, and either cap your well, or convert it to agricultural use. I was _supposed_ to have my connections made to the city system by the end of December, but due to lack of money available for such things, we didn't do it. Now I'm waiting to see what "the powers that be" will do to us to force compliance. Drinking "city" water --- I can sure tell when I am, and I can't stand it. ----- Karen Litman >> To avoid tap water, I usually drink bottled water, which is a whole different adventure. Certain types of plastics lend their flavor to the water, and water in glass bottles costs a fortune. I don't even want to get going on the subject of genetically engineered food unless we take it to the morals list. Every time I eat I check my forearms for signs of changeover. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 04:15:10 +1100 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: "Jenn V." Subject: Re: Aspartame Article MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Annpiccolo@AOL.COM wrote: > To avoid tap water, I usually drink bottled water, which is a whole different > adventure. Certain types of plastics lend their flavor to the water, and > water in glass bottles costs a fortune. I don't even want to get going on the > subject of genetically engineered food unless we take it to the morals list. > Every time I eat I check my forearms for signs of changeover. And, of course, I've heard that you *don't* leave bottled water in the sun - unless it's truly honest-to-god distilled & totally sanitised. Merely filtered will contain just enough bacteria and bacteria-food that sunlight encourages growth... Jenn V. -- It's amazing where you can go with a completely false premise Jenn Vesperman jenn@simegen.com http://www.simegen.com/~jenn -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 http://www.geekcode.com/ GCS/L/TW d- s:+ a C+++ U++++$ P++ L++$ W++ N o? K w PS+ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X R+++ tv-- b+++ DI++ D+ G e++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 12:52:13 EST Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: Annpiccolo@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Aspartame Article Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 99-01-02 12:26:25 EST, you write: << And, of course, I've heard that you *don't* leave bottled water in the sun - unless it's truly honest-to-god distilled & totally sanitised. Merely filtered will contain just enough bacteria and bacteria-food that sunlight encourages growth... >> I have for years put myself in charge of cleaning office water coolers near my desk. Whenever I start a new job, I clean the water cooler first thing. Everyone thinks I am insane until they see what's lurking in the water they thought was so much safer than drinking out of the toilet bowl. If water coolers are not cleaned regularly in accordance with the instructions your water service will provide if you make a quick phone call to them, they will get scummy and full of green algae stuff. The inside of a dirty water cooler is like the inside of a clogged bathtub drain, only no hair. Wear protective gloves when you clean your office water cooler for the first time! I have seen enough of office water coolers to advise everyone on the list never to drink out a water cooler you don't maintain yourself. I REALLY MEAN THIS!!!!!!!!!! Don't be fooled by the water service's assurances that they clean the water cooler. Clean it yourself. ---------- You are subscribed to the SIMEGEN-L list. To unsubscribe from this list, send an email to LISTSERV@SIMEGEN.COM with no subject and the text "unsubscribe SIMEGEN-L". ---------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 13:38:25 -0500 Reply-To: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" Sender: "A discussion list for Sime~Gen Fandom" From: John Cowan Subject: Re: Techie mates (was DVIX) In-Reply-To: <199901020039.TAA11481@ids2.idsonline.com> from "coyote" at Jan 1, 99 07:59:16 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit coyote scripsit: > I've found geeks to be loyal; they don't chase other women, they do treat > you with respect and, as you said, they're intelligent and helpful. Mine > rarely cooks, but he does know how, and he doesn't mind eating at > restaurants often, especially if I don't feel like cooking. > > But, for anyone who's thinking of acquiring a pet geek, be aware: they tend > to be introverted and don't operate much on an emotional level (they're > creatures of logic); they don't like shopping, they forget birthdays and > other special occasions, they tend to be messy, and they require heavy > doses of caffeine first thing in the morning to get them going. They also > like homemade meals, 'cause they're used to grabbing what they can at > Mickey D's and running back to the computer. Make sure you bake them some > chocolate chip cookies now and then. That's a geek favorite. All true (except for the McDonald's and the chocolate chips: I'm a diab